Computer Corner

[PurplePenguin]

I'd love to get away from iPhone/Android, but it is becoming harder, rather than easier, to do this. I really struggle with football tickets which are increasingly becoming NFC only and I can't access them as I don't have a google account.

 

[C R]

Which is ironic as Linux was sort of meant to remove the ultra-geeky factor out of Unix!

Not really, it was meant to make available a Unix like environment on, relatively, affordable hardware. Linus started developing the kernel because the minix system was only available under a fairly restrictive license, and also Tanenbaum was favouring 64 bit development, which excluded the widespread x86 32 bit systems available for home use. There's a fairly well known argument between Linus and Tanenbaum at the time. Linux as a user friendly desktop system only came later.

 

[C R]

Not really, it was meant to make available a Unix like environment on, relatively, affordable hardware. Linus started developing the kernel because the minix system was only available under a fairly restrictive license, and also Tanenbaum was favouring 64 bit development, which excluded the widespread x86 32 bit systems available for home use. There's a fairly well known argument between Linus and Tanenbaum at the time. Linux as a user friendly desktop system only came later.

This is the wiki about the argument. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tanenbaum–Torvalds_debate. I remembered wrong about the hardware, it was Tanenbaum that complained about Linux needing an expensive 386 (this was in 92), I mixed up this with a recollection of a different argument.

 

[First Aspect]

I tried Lubuntu, because it was much like Windows, so was quite easy to use and was very lightweight, so would run on an on old laptop that could no longer handle Windows.

It's quite a cash strapped university research group thing, for the same reason.

I can't understand someone who has to use Windows anyway persisting with it in parallel though. Seems bloody minded.

 

[PurplePenguin]

It's quite a cash strapped university research group thing, for the same reason.

I can't understand someone who has to use Windows anyway persisting with it in parallel though. Seems bloody minded.

Running both systems just depends on hard disk size, so in my case I could have a speedy Lubuntu whilst still retaining the ability to load a very slow windows. It just retains the option for minimal effort.

 

[briantrumpet]

I'd love to get away from iPhone/Android, but it is becoming harder, rather than easier, to do this. I really struggle with football tickets which are increasingly becoming NFC only and I can't access them as I don't have a google account.

They are all sneaky buggers and will try to make you dependent one way or another, as the AI companies are trying to do with the education sector.

 

[First Aspect]

They are all sneaky buggers and will try to make you dependent one way or another, as the AI companies are trying to do with the education sector.

The genesis of Android was to develop something relatively open source. The alternative would be a plethora of mutually incompatible operating systems. In turn, some developers, most developers would not bother with apps for all of them. This would not be an improvement. A bit like a plethora of bottom bracket standards.

Put a different way, the alternative to Android did exist, but various developers stopped development (windows, symbian, blackberry) because they were technology islands.

 

[briantrumpet]

The genesis of Android was to develop something relatively open source. The alternative would be a plethora of mutually incompatible operating systems. In turn, some developers, most developers would not bother with apps for all of them. This would not be an improvement. A bit like a plethora of bottom bracket standards.

Put a different way, the alternative to Android did exist, but various developers stopped development (windows, symbian, blackberry) because they were technology islands.

Yep indeed. At least Android is made available to all manufacturers of mobiles, unlike iOS, which (more sneakily) ties you into the hardware too. I've no idea how Apple have avoided the fate of MS, when they were forced to split Internet Explorer out of Windows, which had been excluding other browsers from gaining a foothold.

I've tied myself into the Google world too, so they'll have a lot of data on me... but the trade off is that it's a very useful system at no cost, and I opt out of or block targeted advertising, so it doesn't intrude much (if at all) on my use of the interweb.

That said, I don't employ Google to run my home systems and listen into my conversations or farting via Alexa or Google Home... that would be a step too far for me.

 

[Pblakeney]

Yep indeed. At least Android is made available to all manufacturers of mobiles, unlike iOS, which (more sneakily) ties you into the hardware too. I've no idea how Apple have avoided the fate of MS, when they were forced to split Internet Explorer out of Windows, which had been excluding other browsers from gaining a foothold.

I've tied myself into the Google world too, so they'll have a lot of data on me... but the trade off is that it's a very useful system at no cost, and I opt out of or block targeted advertising, so it doesn't intrude much (if at all) on my use of the interweb.

That said, I don't employ Google to run my home systems and listen into my conversations or farting via Alexa or Google Home... that would be a step too far for me.

One of us is misunderstanding that bit it bold.
The default Apple internet browser is Google, and you can set your own. I use Duck Duck go. Firefox is also popular.

 

[briantrumpet]

One of us is misunderstanding that bit it bold.
The default Apple internet browser is Google, and you can set your own. I use Duck Duck go. Firefox is also popular.

The IE thing was just an example of how a monolithic IT company was forced to open up to competition. Apple is mostly still a closed shop, but the other way around: if you want to use its OS and apps, you have to buy the hardware. And the apps are only available through.... Apple.

 

[icowden]

The default Apple internet browser is Google, and you can set your own. I use Duck Duck go. Firefox is also popular.

Eh? On all my Apple devices it's Safari?

 

[BoldonLad]

The genesis of Android was to develop something relatively open source. The alternative would be a plethora of mutually incompatible operating systems. In turn, some developers, most developers would not bother with apps for all of them. This would not be an improvement. A bit like a plethora of bottom bracket standards.

Put a different way, the alternative to Android did exist, but various developers stopped development (windows, symbian, blackberry) because they were technology islands.

This is exactly how things were way back in pre-history, (say 1967) when I started out in IT. IBM, ICL, UNiVAC, Honeywell and probably more I have forgotten. Not only were the Operating Systems incompatible, but, so was the software and file formats. I recall spending many happy(?) hours working out how to translate Inventory Data from a Honeywell System, so that it could be used on an ICL System 😂

Hardware standards where none existent too, hardware 9eg disk drives) from one system, would not work on another (often, even from the same manufacturer!).

The advent of PCs and the dominance of the IBM PC / MSDOS initially improved this situation, but, the "standards' are stolidly but surely slipping.

 

[BoldonLad]

One of us is misunderstanding that bit it bold.
The default Apple internet browser is Google, and you can set your own. I use Duck Duck go. Firefox is also popular.

Are we talking about search engines, or browsers? not my area of expertise, but, I believe they are not the same thing, and, all of my Apple devices, out of the box, use Safari as the browser.

 

[briantrumpet]

Are we talking about search engines, or browsers? not my area of expertise, but, I believe they are not the same thing, and, all of my Apple devices, out of the box, use Safari as the browser.

Good point. I dare say you can use a different browser in iOS, but no-one I know does.

I do force use of Google stuff on Apple users (only as I've got useful stuff they sometimes need to see), but one or two make a point of looking down their noses as they dislike leaving the safety of their warm fluffy Apple-only apps.

 

[Pblakeney]

Are we talking about search engines, or browsers? not my area of expertise, but, I believe they are not the same thing, and, all of my Apple devices, out of the box, use Safari as the browser.

That's why I mentioned Firefox as an alternative option.
Strangely enough I have a Google account on my Apple devices. I don't see any reason be isolated in any system.