League Tables

[C R]

Don't be coy: who bought themselves a health secretary?

This piece from the Good Law Project makes for grim reading

https://goodlawproject.org/how-private-health-has-invested-in-wes-streeting/

 

[Ian H]

The list of donors included French and US health insurance companies. Someone posted a link to it in the Starmer thread, I think.

Private Eye has a comprehensive list of donations to members of the current government.

 

[icowden]

Failing managers moving to other (or even better positions) indicates a sort of "old-boy network" in operation, or that the skill sets required are so rare that a failing manager is better than the alternative of no manager. This is not restricted to the NHS or public services

You might think that, but for work in government departments, the sad reality is that it is incredibly difficult to sack someone who is incompetent and quite often difficult to even get a fair hearing in the first place.

When I was first working as a medical secretary our lovely and very good manager had to retire due to ill health and she was replaced by a domineering, bullying, micromanaging type of manager. She immediately clashed with me because I wasn't going to do things that were obviously nonsense or which were going to compromise the Consultants or the work we needed to do. She only tried to understand things at a basic level - for example she would look at the typing backlog and tell us to get it all typed, whilst failing to understand that some typing (e.g. the weekly medication clinic, or reports due for Education Statements which has a fixed timescale) was more urgent than other typing (e.g. 6 monthly development reviews). She would also bully, be rude etc to the point where we were ensuring that we were never in a room with her alone.

Anyway, after many complaints to management they leaped into action and decided that we were all trouble makers. I was given a warning and moved to another department, several staff quit, another just went to work to rule etc. After another year of this, they took action again, and moved the manager to a head office role on more money but where she didn't have to actually manage anyone. No apologies to any of the staff who had been moved, belittled, bullied or anything else.

As far as I know she is still working there. She shouldn't be.

 

[C R]

You might think that, but for work in government departments, the sad reality is that it is incredibly difficult to sack someone who is incompetent and quite often difficult to even get a fair hearing in the first place.

When I was first working as a medical secretary our lovely and very good manager had to retire due to ill health and she was replaced by a domineering, bullying, micromanaging type of manager. She immediately clashed with me because I wasn't going to do things that were obviously nonsense or which were going to compromise the Consultants or the work we needed to do. She only tried to understand things at a basic level - for example she would look at the typing backlog and tell us to get it all typed, whilst failing to understand that some typing (e.g. the weekly medication clinic, or reports due for Education Statements which has a fixed timescale) was more urgent than other typing (e.g. 6 monthly development reviews). She would also bully, be rude etc to the point where we were ensuring that we were never in a room with her alone.

Anyway, after many complaints to management they leaped into action and decided that we were all trouble makers. I was given a warning and moved to another department, several staff quit, another just went to work to rule etc. After another year of this, they took action again, and moved the manager to a head office role on more money but where she didn't have to actually manage anyone. No apologies to any of the staff who had been moved, belittled, bullied or anything else.

As far as I know she is still working there. She shouldn't be.

That happens in big companies too, it isn't exclusive to the public sector.

 

[icowden]

That happens in big companies too, it isn't exclusive to the public sector.

But it is a lot easier for companies to sack people than public sector. It's very rare for public sector to sack anyone, largely because there has to be a cumbersome process of verbal warnings, written warnings, interventions, occupational health assessments etc etc. Public sector quite often ends up paying extended salaries to people who are "off sick" (milking the system) plus the salary of someone to actually do the job.

 

[C R]

But it is a lot easier for companies to sack people than public sector. It's very rare for public sector to sack anyone, largely because there has to be a cumbersome process of verbal warnings, written warnings, interventions, occupational health assessments etc etc. Public sector quite often ends up paying extended salaries to people who are "off sick" (milking the system) plus the salary of someone to actually do the job.

You're so naive. All that happens in the private sector too, it just happens that the mail and the telegraph don't get worked up about it.

 

[spen666]

But it is a lot easier for companies to sack people than public sector. It's very rare for public sector to sack anyone, largely because there has to be a cumbersome process of verbal warnings, written warnings, interventions, occupational health assessments etc etc. Public sector quite often ends up paying extended salaries to people who are "off sick" (milking the system) plus the salary of someone to actually do the job.

AS CR says, the same applies in private sector as well.
The difference is those in private sector have the testicles to get on with it and do not fear the potential issues unlike those in the public sector

 

[BoldonLad]

AS CR says, the same applies in private sector as well.
The difference is those in private sector have the testicles to get on with it and do not fear the potential issues unlike those in the public sector

Is it not down to much more simple factors:

Public bodies do not typically go bust

It is “government money”, little incentive to save it.

PR is more relevant in Public Sector, people expect Private Sector to be ruthless, not so Public Sector

Although perhaps not true, Government is perceived as a bottomless pit.

 

[LCpl Boiled Egg]

I worked in the public sector for 15+ years and lost count of the number of people we got rid of for not being able to do their jobs. Each one was gone within 6 months.

I've been in the private sector for two years, and have to work every day with someone who is so utterly incompetent I can't even begin to describe their faults. I wouldn't trust them to make a cup of tea and have learnt nothing from them in all the time I've been here despite them being a level above me. I've got to the stage where I'm self learning in work time in order to get out of here as soon as I can.

They'll never leave, nor will they be managed out. We're not talking about a small company either - I would say a household name.

 

[C R]

I worked in the public sector for 15+ years and lost count of the number of people we got rid of for not being able to do their jobs. Each one was gone within 6 months.

I've been in the private sector for two years, and have to work every day with someone who is so utterly incompetent I can't even begin to describe their faults. I wouldn't trust them to make a cup of tea and have learnt nothing from them in all the time I've been here despite them being a level above me. I've got to the stage where I'm self learning in work time in order to get out of here as soon as I can.

They'll never leave, nor will they be managed out. We're not talking about a small company either - I would say a household name.

Big companies are worse than small companies for that. And the ambitious guys that never stay long enough in a post to suffer the consequences of their brilliance are a feature of big household name companies.

 

[stowie]

You might think that, but for work in government departments, the sad reality is that it is incredibly difficult to sack someone who is incompetent and quite often difficult to even get a fair hearing in the first place.

When I was first working as a medical secretary our lovely and very good manager had to retire due to ill health and she was replaced by a domineering, bullying, micromanaging type of manager. She immediately clashed with me because I wasn't going to do things that were obviously nonsense or which were going to compromise the Consultants or the work we needed to do. She only tried to understand things at a basic level - for example she would look at the typing backlog and tell us to get it all typed, whilst failing to understand that some typing (e.g. the weekly medication clinic, or reports due for Education Statements which has a fixed timescale) was more urgent than other typing (e.g. 6 monthly development reviews). She would also bully, be rude etc to the point where we were ensuring that we were never in a room with her alone.

Anyway, after many complaints to management they leaped into action and decided that we were all trouble makers. I was given a warning and moved to another department, several staff quit, another just went to work to rule etc. After another year of this, they took action again, and moved the manager to a head office role on more money but where she didn't have to actually manage anyone. No apologies to any of the staff who had been moved, belittled, bullied or anything else.

As far as I know she is still working there. She shouldn't be.

Believe me, this problem is not restricted to public sector! Any large organisation I have worked at has people at various levels who are simply incapable of doing the role, and others who are deeply unpleasant to work with. And sometimes a management who are - for whatever reason - incredibly reluctant to do anything about it.

In the private sector I have worked alongside total psychopaths who get confused somehow as people who can "get things done". They normally stick around for 1-2 years as this is when the employees subjected to their "management style" get new jobs and the exodus begins.

The lack of management ability has been astonishing at times in the private sector. In my opinion, private sector efficiency vs public sector is a myth.