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midlandsgrimpeur

Senior Member
C R said:
The funniest/saddest part of al this is that guardian readers were aghast at Mandelson's appointment, whereas all the right wingers now whinging were defending the appointment.
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Many on the right are also aghast now they have seen an opportunity to try and engineer a Starmer resignation.

I suspect the next possible angles in the media will be:

- it doesn't matter if he told the truth, he should have known and is therefore responsible for it all
- he has no control of his staff he isn't fit to lead
- the country is being run by unelected mandarins he should resign
 
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TailWindHome

Über Member
CXRAndy said:
Someone is telling lies over this, I need verification
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Who are the possible liars?

If you've already decided someone is lying, you don't really need verification, do you?
 
briantrumpet

briantrumpet

Timewaster
midlandsgrimpeur said:
Many on the right are also aghast now they have seen an opportunity to try and engineer a Starmer resignation.

I suspect the next possible angles in the media will be:

- it doesn't matter if he told the truth, he should have known and is therefore responsible for it all
- he has no control of his staff he isn't fit to lead
- the country is being run by unelected mandarins he should resign
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It does have all the hallmarks of the repeated angles they took on Rayner till they 'got her'. There's no Starmer-worship on here – he's a deep disappointment in many ways – but as I say, I think he's going to get out of this one, as there's no smoking gun as such, just more uninterested Starmerism.
 
Psamathe

Psamathe

Legendary Member
Robins was appointed (8 Jan 2025) after Mandelson was appointed (20 Dec 2024). Despite Mandelson being already appointed when Robbins took his post, Robbins takes the blame.

Looks to me like Starmer found a scapegoat, throwing people "under the bus" to protect his position.
 
M

midlandsgrimpeur

Senior Member
briantrumpet said:
It does have all the hallmarks of the repeated angles they took on Rayner till they 'got her'. There's no Starmer-worship on here – he's a deep disappointment in many ways – but as I say, I think he's going to get out of this one, as there's no smoking gun as such, just more uninterested Starmerism.
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It seems that way. Starmer is guilty of very bad political decisions, but people have an option to address that, vote him/Labour out. Up to this point though there is nothing to suggest any real examples of impropriety which would necessitate a resignation.
 
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Psamathe

Psamathe

Legendary Member
midlandsgrimpeur said:
Many on the right are also aghast now they have seen an opportunity to try and engineer a Starmer resignation.
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Trouble is, whilst I regard Starmer as pretty terrible, were he to step down today we'd almost certainly get Streeting who'd be a lot lot lot worse. Rayner apparently not sorted HMRC yet/enough and Burnham not (yet) an MP. can think of any others high on the likely successor list.
 
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TailWindHome

Über Member
Psamathe said:
Robins was appointed (8 Jan 2025) after Mandelson was appointed (20 Dec 2024). Despite Mandelson being already appointed when Robbins took his post, Robbins takes the blame.

Looks to me like Starmer found a scapegoat, throwing people "under the bus" to protect his position.
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You're ignoring the fact that the vetting came after the announcement and his taking up the role.

Starmer can't be guilty of ignoring a vetting 'fail' which hadn"t happened yet

Let's all agree on the linear nature of time (if nothing else)
 
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TailWindHome

Über Member
Pross said:
Not sure that would have worked for her dealing with a misogynistic, sex abuser though.
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She was well liked within the Trump administration, having had the foresight to maintain her connections with his people through the Biden years
 
Psamathe

Psamathe

Legendary Member
TailWindHome said:
You're ignoring the fact that the vetting came after the announcement and his taking up the role.

Starmer can't be guilty of ignoring a vetting 'fail' which hadn"t happened yet

Let's all agree on the linear nature of time (if nothing else)
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I was thinking about Robbins taking the fall when Starmer had already appointed Mandelson before Robbins was even in post (Gov. website published the appointment 20 Dec). To have "we've changed our mind now security vetting results are finished" would have sent every journalist into checking out Mandelson's "issues" (and thus been totally unfair on Mandelson).
 
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CXRAndy

CXRAndy

Epic Member
TailWindHome said:
You're ignoring the fact that the vetting came after the announcement and his taking up the role.

Starmer can't be guilty of ignoring a vetting 'fail' which hadn"t happened yet

Let's all agree on the linear nature of time (if nothing else)
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Err

Mandleson had already failed vetting in early Sept 2024- Maddox (independent) told Downing Street head of communications at that point- prior to news article published 11 September 2024

Starmer says in parliament due process was followed in September 10 2024

starmer failed to correct any miscommunication at the earliest opportunity in parliament, following week/s. Ministerial code fail

Starmer announces around the 19/20 December 2024 appointing mandleson US ambassador

February 2025 Starmer says mandleson passed vetting in news interview

Mandleson takes up position 10 February 2025

starmer now says he wasnt told, nor any of his ministers when his head of communications was informed back in Sept 2024

So ministers were aware. There is no way director of communication did not tell anyone of the WhatsApp messages with Maddox
 
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