Two-tier? JSO vs Dover protest

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matticus

Legendary Member
Couknd't find any posts about this, so I'll dive in with both feet ...
This week has been the most shocking display of unbalancved policing in a while:
JSO in Westminster; peaceful protests, no masks, lady vicars calmly debating with arresting officers and journalists. Dozesns of arrests, 41 people charged.
Dover; police quietly whistle.

I don't know what else to say.
 

Psamathe

Legendary Member
I agree. Dover and nor Portsmouth protests without complying with the law and Police just appear to watch.

And given how readily Police drag off large numbers at other protests, why not Dover & Portsmouth? Very 2-tier.
 

monkers

Shaman
I agree. Dover and nor Portsmouth protests without complying with the law and Police just appear to watch.

And given how readily Police drag off large numbers at other protests, why not Dover & Portsmouth? Very 2-tier.

The data would be interesting to examine. I'm trying to keep of AI these days - but this was the perfect question for AI to produce an answer in about a second. Probably an imperfect question; probably an imperfect answer. The number though is stark.

Quote:
Gemini ... What is the ratio in the number of arrests between PA and assorted climate protesters with the number of Unite the Kingdom protesters?


Quote:
Cumulative Campaign Arrests vs. Single Event Arrests: Comparing the total multi-year arrest pool of PA, IB, ER, and JSO (~7,500) to a typical single "Unite the Kingdom" event (~23 arrests) yields a ratio of roughly 325:1.


The number of JSO arrests alone was about 40 - assorted offences including blocking the highway. Many are serving prison sentences.

Number of Unite the Nation arrests in Dover for blocking the highway - zero.

According to reports - plenty of video on youtube - last night 140 asylum seekers were landed by RNLI at Eastney beach on Portsea Island (Portsmouth). The asylum seekers were loaded onto three coaches to be taken to Manston (Ramsgate) to be processed. Hundred of protesters took to the streets, blocking roads preventing the coaches from leaving. Dramatic scenes of protesters breaking through cordons, breaking the windscreens of police cars. Scenes of police fighting protesters in the sea. Zero arrests.
 
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briantrumpet

Timewaster
This is how to normalise fascist thugs who want to scare everyone into not pushing back against their framing of asylum-seekers. I'd have thought that 48 hours was enough for Burnham and Mahmood to realise that by not condemning them and telling them that they'll be arrested, they are inviting them to do it again.

1788770936827.png
 

secretsqirrel

spiteful class warrior
This is how to normalise fascist thugs who want to scare everyone into not pushing back against their framing of asylum-seekers. I'd have thought that 48 hours was enough for Burnham and Mahmood to realise that by not condemning them and telling them that they'll be arrested, they are inviting them to do it again.

View attachment 17109

Yeah I listened to Donna Jones in R5 this morning. She started on about peaceful protest, ok. As the interview went on she went full Kemical, blaming the EU, not done Brexit properly, leave ECHR, turn the boats back. Objected to the boats being brought ashore in Portsmouth by RNLI and not Dover.
The interviewer (Steffan Powell) pointed out that boat crossings were falling, she was having none of it. I wish he had called out that this wasn’t an issue before Brexit.
 

Dorset Boy

Senior Member
This is how to normalise fascist thugs who want to scare everyone into not pushing back against their framing of asylum-seekers. I'd have thought that 48 hours was enough for Burnham and Mahmood to realise that by not condemning them and telling them that they'll be arrested, they are inviting them to do it again.

View attachment 17109

She did condemn them on the radio this morning - she stated that peaceful protest is fine, but intimidatory protest as a result of being masked up was not, and that violence is not an acceptable way to protest. she also pointed out that many police from across the south were called away from their normal duties to head to the protest, and wasn't happy that was necessary.
She is clearly a brexiteer though and anti the ECHR, and made that clear. She said that by leaving the ECHR she believed the boats could be turned around.
She wasn't happy that Portsmouth was used as they are not geared up for such landings.
She did struggle when it was pointed out that crossings have fallen substantially this year.
 
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Dorset Boy

Senior Member
This is how to normalise fascist thugs who want to scare everyone into not pushing back against their framing of asylum-seekers. I'd have thought that 48 hours was enough for Burnham and Mahmood to realise that by not condemning them and telling them that they'll be arrested, they are inviting them to do it again.

View attachment 17109

From your favourite news outlet:
1788773256312.png
 

briantrumpet

Timewaster
She did condemn them on the radio this morning - she stated that peaceful protest is fine, but intimidatory protest as a result of being masked up was not, and that violence is not an acceptable way to protest. she also pointed out that many police from across the south were called away from their normal duties to head to the protest, and wasn't happy that was necessary.
She is clearly a brexiteer though and anti the ECHR, and made that clear. She said that by leaving the ECHR she believed the boats could be turned around.
She wasn't happy that Portsmouth was used as they are not geared up for such landings.
She did struggle when it was pointed out that crossings have fallen substantially this year.

Thanks for the summary.
 

briantrumpet

Timewaster
Yeah I listened to Donna Jones in R5 this morning. She started on about peaceful protest, ok. As the interview went on she went full Kemical, blaming the EU, not done Brexit properly, leave ECHR, turn the boats back. Objected to the boats being brought ashore in Portsmouth by RNLI and not Dover.
The interviewer (Steffan Powell) pointed out that boat crossings were falling, she was having none of it. I wish he had called out that this wasn’t an issue before Brexit.

I guess she's signed up to the Badenoch pledge not to disagree with Badenoch on anything.
 

monkers

Shaman
In an entirely different context, I've heard the phrase ''it's not the size of your boat, it's the motion of the ocean''.

And so it is the case here - the size of the boat is an irrelevance to the arguments often presented. The number of people arriving is something that can be a focus and concern to both sides. Where both sides may disagree is the validity and balance of human rights, and the treatment of people.

There are legal, technical and human behavioural arguments against the suggestion of a real world solution, such that no solution is acceptable.

For example, I might structure a solution thus:

The lack of safe routes imperils the attempts to cross the channel by inflatable craft often overcrowded, and sometime carrying children. To prevent their arrival, the expenditure to police borders is a burden to the taxpayer. The expenditure is also a burden to the RNLI who rely on charitable support to meet the cost.

Protester behaviour is paradoxical. For example, the Portsmouth example from last night, demonstrated that while asylum seekers were already loaded onto coaches ready to be removed to Manston, they were prevented from leaving due to protesters laying down in the road.

One solution to end the unsafe boat crossings is the creation of safer routes for those crossing, and safer environments for landing them.

Manston is only quite recently disused as an airfield and has the UK aslyum seeker's processing centre alongside. A safe route could be provided by flying the asylum seekers direct from an agreed airfield in France directly to Manston and thence the neighbouring processing centre.

In the real world however, there will be sovereignty arguments, and roadblocks by way of legal and technical arguments rather than concern for those who arrive in genuine need of asylum.

I've posting without reading back and editing, as I have something else now to attend to - errors inevitable I'm afraid.
 
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