Contradictory Messages

[Ian H]

Isn't that what is usually called "whataboutery", on this forum?

Perhaps, they shouldn't be allowed to serve in the armed forces?

It is somewhat controversial*. The old argument was on the lines of if they're old enough to fight, they're old enough to vote, though I understand they only become cannon-fodder at 18 these days.
It's whataboutery if it's irrelevant. Our views on that may differ.
*other European countries don't recruit as young.

 

[BoldonLad]

It is somewhat controversial*. The old argument was on the lines of if they're old enough to fight, they're old enough to vote, though I understand they only become cannon-fodder at 18 these days.
It's whataboutery if it's irrelevant. Our views on that may differ.
*other European countries don't recruit as young.

I didn't think we were really disagreeing, I was simply pointing out that the miss-match could be fixed by raising the age to join the armed forces, ie, lowering the voting age was not the ONLY option, as advantageous as it may (or may not) be to any particular party.

 

[ebikeerwidnes]

I think the idea about not sentencing younger adult in the same way is down to the fact (???) that under 25s are more receptive to rehabilitation becuase they are less set in their ways and their mind is still developing
So the 'evil' in the person is not set in place in the same way

Hence the emphasis on rehabilitation rather than punishment.

All of which I would agree with unless the person is not engaging with the rehabilitation or is shown to be re-offending and/or is a risk to society
in which case the offender should be able to be recalled
In which case maybe there should be 2 sentences issues
One for the "you are under 25 and so have a good change of rehab" and one - made clear at the time - for the "OK tried that didn;t work so we'll go with plan B as stated at the trial)

maybe
what do I know?

 

[Deleted member 28]

I think the idea about not sentencing younger adult in the same way is down to the fact (???) that under 25s are more receptive to rehabilitation becuase they are less set in their ways and their mind is still developing
what do I know?

My lad works in a YOI and I can assure you the average scrote that passes through his nick are in no way receptive to rehabilitation as they're back time and time again, so to answer your question, f*ck all with regards to this one.

 

[Ian H]

My lad works in a YOI and I can assure you the average scrote that passes through his nick are in no way receptive to rehabilitation as they're back time and time again, so to answer your question, f*ck all with regards to this one.

The actual rate is a bit over 30%.

 

[BoldonLad]

My lad works in a YOI and I can assure you the average scrote that passes through his nick are in no way receptive to rehabilitation as they're back time and time again, so to answer your question, f*ck all with regards to this one.

Don't think that is surprising really, by the time they get sent to YOI, they will already have a substantial record of offending, in most cases.

 

[newfhouse]

My lad works in a YOI and I can assure you the average scrote that passes through his nick are in no way receptive to rehabilitation as they're back time and time again, so to answer your question, f*ck all with regards to this one.

Which only goes to show that prison alone doesn’t work if the aim is to reduce offending.

 

[Deleted member 28]

Which only goes to show that prison alone doesn’t work if the aim is to reduce offending.

Absolutely, keeps the little sh*ts off the streets for a while though.

 

[Deleted member 28]

The actual rate is a bit over 30%.

And?

So he sees around 1 in 3 return, your point is what exactly?

 

[Ian H]

And?

So he sees around 1 in 3 return, your point is what exactly?

My point? Just putting a figure on your son's comment. Is that contentious?

 

[Deleted member 28]

My point? Just putting a figure on your son's comment. Is that contentious?

Well thanks for that, next time he mentions having a repeat offender in I'll be sure to inform him of your findings.

 

[ebikeerwidnes]

I suppose I can see the point - having taught in secondary school for many years I can see that there are many teenagers that are mentally unable to accept that anyone is allowed to tell them anything - and especially anything they don't want to hear

But I think we should give them a chance if there is a possibility
But that is also why I mentioned 2 sentences - so there is an "over ready" sentence already known and ladif down if they re-offend
and, of course, it would have to be a one time deal - no second short sentence if they get out and get caught again


It needs someone who has the proper data and evidence to make a proper case either way

 

[Beebo]

If we are really talking contradictory messages, why do under 23 year olds get a lower minimum wage?

There are 4 bands
U18
18-20
22-22
Over 23

If voter age is 18 and tax rates are the same why is pay banded?

 

[theclaud]

Loving the idea that voting is so solemn and responsible and sophisticated that 16-year-olds can't be trusted with it.

Meanwhile boomers go about exercising their solemn responsibilities making choices that effect all of us...

 

[Deleted member 49]

Absolutely, keeps the little sh*ts off the streets for a while though.

That's basically it...no rehabilitation or help just a holding ground for a while.How many of those kids have been through the care system/care homes and been groomed for a life of crime.Privatised kids homes with no interest in anything but profits.Once in it isn't a easy escape to a normal life.