First Past The Post - A broken system? What are the alternatives? What would work better for the UK?

[Pale Rider]

You make a fair point but I do disagree with this analysis. Had UKIP been represented in the Commons on a proportional basis, the British public would have witnessed the brawling in the corridors of parliament which they descended to in the EU parliament, the gratuitous insults handed out by Nigel Farage and the uncooperative destructive bullying which they engaged in instead of reasoned debate. The British electorate would have seen them for what they were and they would never have gone beyond the status of fringe extremists. In my opinion it is precisely because they were kept out of parliament that they were able to present themselves as embodying a popular true faith which, in fact, nobody subscribed to in the form which they were determined to realize.

I suppose it is possible 80 UKIP MPs would have shown up UKIP for what it is.

But I would have thought a bigger danger for the UKIP haters is the public would come to like what they saw.

For UKIP haters, I think their best protection remains an electoral system the keeps UKIP on the outside of the tent.

 

[mudsticks]

We had a big old thread about this at the start of NACA I believe

It's not so difficult to look at our European neighbours for examples of workable PR.

I've had a good few interesting chats with my German colleague about how the system works there.
More complicated in some ways, but far more democratically representative.
If they (and other countries) can manage to wrangle it then I'm sure we could .

Surely no one would suggest that German voters are brighter than UK ones, are they .??

It would get over all this lurching from one side to t'other with the one party undoing the work of the other - good or bad - almost out of spite.

Having too much power in too few politically weighted hands.

It would make people work together, and find commonalities, in coalition to get stuff done rather than always being in opposition, just because.
Just like the rest of us have to, out here in the big bad 'real world'

Sure you might end up with a few 'nut jobs' inside parliament, but I'd say better there potentially being moderated by sensible grown up discourse and debate - rather than flailing about on the outside claiming to have been 'cancelled' and drawing others into their orbit of false victimhood.

 

[spen666]

A camel is a horse designed by a committee

Sir Alec Issigonis, 1959

 

[newfhouse]

Sir Alec Issigonis, 1959

Camels are perfectly adapted to their environment.

 

[spen666]

Camels are perfectly adapted to their environment.

When I see one win the Grand National or the Derby I will happily agree with you.

so far one have not even got placed in any of the major Flat or Jump races in the UK. They need to adapt better

 

[Bromptonaut]

When I see one win the Grand National or the Derby I will happily agree with you.

so far one have not even got placed in any of the major Flat or Jump races in the UK. They need to adapt better

True, but Red Rum wouldn't have lasted long as a 'ship of the desert'.

Horses for Courses and all that.

 

[newfhouse]

When I see one win the Grand National or the Derby I will happily agree with you.

so far one have not even got placed in any of the major Flat or Jump races in the UK. They need to adapt better

Yeah, I’m not sure whipping animals to divert the attention of the general population while being the playthings of the rich is the analogy we need in this thread.

 

[Pale Rider]

Yeah, I’m not sure whipping animals to divert the attention of the general population while being the playthings of the rich is the analogy we need in this thread.

Racing is known as the Sport of Kings, but as well as monarchs, it has followers from all walks of life, very much including the working classes.

Perhaps that's why the general populace understands the value of first past the post.

 

[newfhouse]

Racing is known as the Sport of Kings, but as well as monarchs, it has followers from all walks of life, very much including the working classes.

That's pretty much what I said.

 

[Pale Rider]

That's pretty much what I said.

Although I doubt you agree with the bit you didn't quote - unless you've come to realise the value of first past the post in racing and elections.

I can't recall what you think, but I'm taking a flyer you dislike it in elections because you moan and complain about practically everything else in this country.

 

[newfhouse]

I doubt you agree with the bit you didn't quote

Your journalist brain is working overtime, eh?

I'm taking a flyer you dislike it in elections

Yes. It's one source of poor and unrepresentative government.

you moan and complain about practically everything else in this country.

How terribly British of me. Are you going to suggest I should instead return to the lands of my ancestors?

 

[Mr Celine]

Proportional representation for a horse race is as absurd as first past the post for a general election.

 

[the snail]

I'm surprised that anyone would want to change the current system, after witnessing the fantastic success of the recent strong tory governments with their 80 seat majority. Remind me, who is prime minister this week?

 

[BoldonLad]

Whilst reading a news article relating to the Nobel Prizes, just noticed that Sweden has a form of PR. Apparently, their parliament also has approximately a fifth of it's seats held by an anti-immigrant, pro-Nazi party. Not desirable.

 

[All uphill]

Whilst reading a news article relating to the Nobel Prizes, just noticed that Sweden has a form of PR. Apparently, their parliament also has approximately a fifth of it's seats held by an anti-immigrant, pro-Nazi party. Not desirable.

Better, imo, to have them out in the open sharing some responsibility than justifiably feeling excluded and unheard.