hypocrisy of the media

[CXRAndy]

Well quite. It's nothing special these days given property prices etc.

This is very true, but would you say if someone paid for their own property with cash outright and it costs more than £1m, a millionaire?

 

[Stevo 666]

This is very true, but would you say if someone paid for their own property with cash outright and it costs more than £1m, a millionaire?

Of course, it's about total assets less total liabilities. In your scenario, all they have done is swapped a £1m+ cash asset for a £1m+ property asset. Is that what you did?

 

[CXRAndy]

Of course, it's about total assets less total liabilities. In your scenario, all they have done is swapped a £1m+ cash asset for a £1m+ property asset. Is that what you did?

I took some money out of savings and bought a property for wife and I to move. We kept our old property until the spring and sold for better price on a rising market. Spent that money buying properties for our children

 

[Stevo 666]

I took some money out of savings and bought a property for wife and I to move. We kept our old property until the spring and sold for better price on a rising market. Spent that money buying properties for our children

Fair play to you.

To be clear, my point above was about showing how anyone who is a millionaire should not be automatically labelled as rich.

 

[CXRAndy]

Fair play to you.

To be clear, my point above was about showing how anyone who is a millionaire should not be automatically labelled as rich.

That is true.

Old accounting adage

Turnover is vanity , profit is sanity

 

[Stevo 666]

That is true.

Old accounting adage

Turnover is vanity , profit is sanity

And cash is king.

A lot of people who are paper millionaires are not cash rich. Simplest example of the old biddy who is living in the house she bought 60 years ago somewhere in the South East. She could feasibly only have the state pension and maybe some modest occupational pensions as income but is a paper millionaire due to the house.

 

[CXRAndy]

Absolutely bang on, 👍


Property assets is one thing, liquid asset to everyday living is crucial

 

[Psamathe]

But does he spend all his time on the net boasting of his wealth and possessions ...

In my experience people who feel the need to boast about such matters tend not to have it in the real world.

Ian

 

[midlandsgrimpeur]

And cash is king.

A lot of people who are paper millionaires are not cash rich. Simplest example of the old biddy who is living in the house she bought 60 years ago somewhere in the South East. She could feasibly only have the state pension and maybe some modest occupational pensions as income but is a paper millionaire due to the house.

I suspect this is true at all levels of extreme wealth, even Billionaires. Most will essentially be funded by huge lines of credit and financing deals, not actual cash. I suspect if you were talking about actual cash in the bank, Bill Gates is probably far wealthier than Musk, Bezos, Zuckerberg etc.

 

[icowden]

I didn't know anything about the owner of the DM but a quick google shows it to be Daily Mail and General Trust plc, a UK resident company.

The owner and major shareholder of DMGT is Jonathan Harmsworth the 4th Viscount Rothermere. For tax purposes he lives in Monaco, pays tax in France and identifies as French. DMGT is a UK company but the controlling shareholder (with 100% of the shares) is Rothermere Continuation Limited which is registered in Bermuda and managed DMGT via a discretionary Trust. registered in Bermuda and pays no tax anywhere. He does maintain the Rothermere stately home in Wiltshire. He is worth around £1bn.

 

[icowden]

Depending on how you define “millionaire”, I would have thought there are quite a few in the South of UK, given property prices. I even suspect my son is a millionaire.

Indeed. My inlaws were very close to it at one point based on living in a 4 bed house in Kingston. I'm 75% of the way there in my little house.

 

[Stevo 666]

I suspect this is true at all levels of extreme wealth, even Billionaires. Most will essentially be funded by huge lines of credit and financing deals, not actual cash. I suspect if you were talking about actual cash in the bank, Bill Gates is probably far wealthier than Musk, Bezos, Zuckerberg etc.

Liquidity is also important - so the billionaires owning a significant stake in a quoted company can cash out shares pretty easily if needed.

 

[Stevo 666]

The owner and major shareholder of DMGT is Jonathan Harmsworth the 4th Viscount Rothermere. For tax purposes he lives in Monaco, pays tax in France and identifies as French. DMGT is a UK company but the controlling shareholder (with 100% of the shares) is Rothermere Continuation Limited which is registered in Bermuda and managed DMGT via a discretionary Trust. registered in Bermuda and pays no tax anywhere. He does maintain the Rothermere stately home in Wiltshire. He is worth around £1bn.

Someone with that level of assets and income who also a registered non-dom and has a complex set of tax affairs will no doubt be on the radar of HMRC. It doesn't necessarily mean that it is not legal though. Are you aware of any court cases or challenges to his tax position/tax affairs?

 

[icowden]

It doesn't necessarily mean that it is not legal though. Are you aware of any court cases or challenges to his tax position/tax affairs?

Nobody has said that it's illegal. What they have said is that it's immoral to own a paper and take the editorial line that the Mail takes (patriotic humbuggery) whilst paying no tax in the UK. If Rothermere was truly a patriotic Brit he'd pay some sodding tax.

We have the ridiculous situation that most of our Newspapers are owned by people who aren't British or don't want to be.

 

[CXRAndy]

Newspapers are owned by people who aren't British or don't want to be.

Who'd actually sign up to be British currently, who has the wealth to be somewhere much nicer in the world, less crime, lower tax regime.