Reform, and the death of the Tory Party

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First Aspect

Legendary Member
I don't think any party wants to be Reform, but clearly they want to beat them. Hence the policies that they think appeal to enough of the electorate to do that.

There are too few people who are openly racist and xenophobic enough to vote for Reform for those policies alone. Even the Republicans are finding this out. This is why Reform have peaked.

Sadly, it's informed the rest of the parties what might work for them in order to bring the tattooed gammons back to their parties.
 

midlandsgrimpeur

Prostrate Member
I asked first to show me that it is the case. Go on.

It can't be proved either way can it? Your premise is that Reform is offering what "voters want", but voters in this instance is some nebulous concept. Any political party puts forward its policies, by definition that policy can only be wanted by the person that votes for it. If you don't vote for a given party, then you do not want their policy offering.

I think your statement is really more that Reform is more popular than someone on the left may think it is, that could well be the case, but it is not the same argument as Reform are offering what the voters want, they are offering what certain voters want i.e. people who vote Reform.

If I say Labour are just offering "what the voters want" the exact same principle applies. They are not offering what voters want, they are offering what labour voters want.

You use the example that other parties are chasing Reform voters. They are, but they did not win Reform voters in local elections did they? This undermines your whole point. If Reform are offering what voters want and Labour basically offered the same on immigration (as you mention the immigration point), then why didn't people just vote Labour as they were offering what voters want according to your argument?

I am not denying that Reform are popular, I am simply saying that a blanket statement that they are offering what the voters want is far too broad to have any real meaning. They are offering certain policies that appeal to certain voters, just as any political party does. All you can prove after the number of votes counted is that more voters wanted what one party had to offer than the others, but that is not the same thing. Labour just won a by-election so by your definition, Labour is now offering what the voters want. No, Andy Burnham just resonated more in Makersfield and won an election.
 

icowden

Pharaoh
It can't be proved either way can it? Your premise is that Reform is offering what "voters want", but voters in this instance is some nebulous concept. Any political party puts forward its policies, by definition that policy can only be wanted by the person that votes for it. If you don't vote for a given party, then you do not want their policy offering.
Perhaps one "proof" is that Reform are polling at about 25.9% of the vote.

In 2019 the Conservatives won election with 43.6% of the vote. In 2024 Labour won election with 34.7% of the vote. Conservatives lost 19.2% of the vote dropping to 24.4%. 14.7% of that drop went to Reform.

Reform are now polling at about 25.9% of the vote and the Conservatives at 19% of the vote. Reform and Conservatives are a fractured party and neither can win power while the other exists. Reform is offering what the most right wing Tories want. The Conservatives are offering what presumably some people want, although I'm baffled by who.

Labour in the meantime is slightly split with traditionally Labour voters moving toward Green. Labour has lost 14.7% of that 34.7% vote, greens have gained about 6%. The field is fairly evenly split between 5 parties.
 
OP
OP
briantrumpet

briantrumpet

Timewaster
Rache Sylvester in the Observer

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Gweeds

New Member
Farage is now being laughed at. It's hard to come back from that in the UK. Ask Truss.

A real shame as the grifting tool shows himself to be thinner-skinned than a peach, and he's going to have an angry CryptoDaddy now.
 

Pross

Veteran
I like the French name. He should change it for the irony of having a "European" taking on Farage.
 

Pross

Veteran
There's a real danger Count Binface will win.

I think it will depend on whether people drag themselves out. If they do it becomes an effective Farage popularity contest with all those who hate him getting the ultimate opportunity to humiliate him and nothing to split the anti-Farage vote. Even those not very engaged in politics may enjoy the chance to join in the urine extraction.
 
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