BRFR Cake Stop 'breaking news' miscellany

[C R]

Net migration of 200k per year - the most recent guestimate - isn't wildly different from the 2015 era Tory pledge. Does that mean we can all stop worrying because Labour have fulfilled David Cameron's manifesto pledge?

I'll refer you to icoewden's post above

To put in a nutshellwhat I was saying above, we want the right sort of immigrants. And in sensible numbers.

People who say that usually mean "the white ones that don't speak funny".

 

[First Aspect]

I'll refer you to icoewden's post above

In Stevo's defence I don't think he is of the same ilk as MAGAndy. But it will be a fair assessment of too many voters, I am sure you are right about that.

 

[midlandsgrimpeur]

To put in a nutshellwhat I was saying above, we want the right sort of immigrants. And in sensible numbers.

Not sure whst "the right sort of immigrants" are, but any kind of anti immgration rhetoric puts all potential immigrants off. If you are educated, skilled economic migrant, what you see coming from the UK media and politicians will likely dissuade you from coming here.

 

[briantrumpet]

Also FWIW

 

[Shortfall]

No, this is what we term "speculative bollox".

The ONS is quite clear on the drivers:

Looking in more detail, non-EU+ immigration has dropped by more than 350,000 since a year earlier. There was a 49% (or 108,000) decrease in immigration for work (main applicants). Meanwhile, the number of work dependants fell by 81,000 (35%). The fall in immigration for study (main applicants) was smaller at 17% for the same period. However, student dependants dropped by 86% from 121,000 to 17,000.

There has also been an increase in emigration over the 12 months to December 2024, particularly people leaving who originally came on study visas once pandemic travel restrictions to the UK were eased. In fact, the departure of non-EU+ nationals who initially arrived for study has followed an upward trend since YE March 2022. Emigration is now around levels seen in the mid-2010s.

https://news.sky.com/story/number-of-britons-leaving-the-uk-higher-than-previously-thought-13472117

"The number of British nationals who left the UK last year has risen from 77,000 to 257,000, according to revised immigration statistics. "

I don't want to get into tit for tat and claim and counter claim about figures. Truth is the daughter of time as they say and the real test will be a few years hence when we can properly analyse longer term trends. My fear however is that the Labour government's treatment of "the rich" and the better off will lead to more of them leaving in search of more favourable taxation regimes elsewhere.

Put it another way, I bet there's a lot of people in NCAP who voted Labour in the expectation of getting a business friendly, centre left government who would preside over some modest tax rises that they thought were probably inevitable. What have we got instead? One of the biggest transfers of wealth I can remember from hard working tax payers to the Labour party's client state who will see their benefits protected from inflation whilst ordinary working people in low pay jobs are brought into paying tax by the freezing of allowances. Many more who wouldn't have previously been considered rich will also be dragged into higher rate tax bands. Is it really a surprise to anyone that many will start to leave? .

 

[Pross]

Also FWIW

View attachment 11289

Stop shooting down all the populist arguments - they'll just make up new ones.

 

[briantrumpet]

Stop shooting down all the populist arguments - they'll just make up new ones.

Populism only works with enemies to hate. Even if the enemies are just made-up statistics.

 

[PurplePenguin]

https://news.sky.com/story/number-of-britons-leaving-the-uk-higher-than-previously-thought-13472117

"The number of British nationals who left the UK last year has risen from 77,000 to 257,000, according to revised immigration statistics. "

I don't want to get into tit for tat and claim and counter claim about figures. Truth is the daughter of time as they say and the real test will be a few years hence when we can properly analyse longer term trends. My fear however is that the Labour government's treatment of "the rich" and the better off will lead to more of them leaving in search of more favourable taxation regimes elsewhere.

Put it another way, I bet there's a lot of people in NCAP who voted Labour in the expectation of getting a business friendly, centre left government who would preside over some modest tax rises that they thought were probably inevitable. What have we got instead? One of the biggest transfers of wealth I can remember from hard working tax payers to the Labour party's client state who will see their benefits protected from inflation whilst ordinary working people in low pay jobs are brought into paying tax by the freezing of allowances. Many more who wouldn't have previously been considered rich will also be dragged into higher rate tax bands. Is it really a surprise to anyone that many will start to leave? .

It would be interesting to know where people are going. Brits have historically emigrated to the US, Canada, Australia and NZ for work/lifestyle and to Spain and France for retirement. i don't see any of those places as suddenly more appealing due to tax.

Are there now significantly more people going to the UAE or China for high salary low tax jobs?

 

[Beebo]

Are there now significantly more people going to the UAE or China for high salary low tax jobs?

In which case they are hugely hypocritical.
As they are now immigrants in an authoritarian society. I have spent 6 weeks working in UAE and Oman and have friends who were there for 4 years.
Don’t let anyone fool you that UAE is some sort of paradise. Scratch slightly below the surface and it’s an awful place.
The poverty and exploitation of the Indian, far east and African workforce is appalling.

 

[Beebo]

Yes. The media are now saying that this could top 300 dead.

128 confirmed dead now.
But is expected to rise.
I was listening to a husband whose wife died whilst trying to rescue their cat. So sad but really just leave pets behind. It’s not worth it.

 

[Shortfall]

In which case they are hugely hypocritical.
As they are now immigrants in an authoritarian society. I have spent 6 weeks working in UAE and Oman and have friends who were there for 4 years.
Don’t let anyone fool you that UAE is some sort of paradise. Scratch slightly below the surface and it’s an awful place.
The poverty and exploitation of the Indian, far east and African workforce is appalling.

Not that I want to live in China or the UAE personally, what makes someone choosing to live and work there a hypocrite? Genuinely curious why you'd say that.

 

[Beebo]

Not that I want to live in China or the UAE personally, what makes someone choosing to live and work there a hypocrite? Genuinely curious why you'd say that.

Because they are usually claiming to be leaving the UK because they don’t like the way the country is going and it’s full of foreigners.
The people claiming most to support traditional British values are the first to leave when the going gets tough.

 

[Shortfall]

Because they are usually claiming to be leaving the UK because they don’t like the way the country is going and it’s full of foreigners.
The people claiming most to support traditional British values are the first to leave when the going gets tough.

No sweeping generalisations there then. Obviously true of some people but so what? Are you confusing the tiny handful of right wing posters in NCAP for people in the real world?

 

[Dorset Boy]

I do think the likes of Dubai and Abu Dhabi have become a lot more popular, even if only for a 5 year period of higher wages, and no tax, for some.

 

[Psamathe]

I do think the likes of Dubai and Abu Dhabi have become a lot more popular, even if only for a 5 year period of higher wages, and no tax, for some.

They were reporting on the radio (BBC R4) this morning that a lot of 30'ish year olds working in the health service are emigrating to Australia where they get higher pay, more civilised working conditions, are welcomed, etc. That said, it was from an interviewee and I can't remember who or what organisation and no numbers so probably true but uncertain how significant.