But Where Are You Really From?

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winjim

Welcome yourself into the new modern crisis
Hmmn, I don't think there's any excuse for her abject and persistently racist rudeness I'm afraid.

Age 'class' (sic🙄) background or whatever..

It's not like she's some little old lady from the back of beyond, who has never come into contact with anyone from 'outside of the village' which might excuse some social ineptness, in this kind of interaction .

'Lady' Hussey, was supposed to be 'welcoming' people to this event.
She's been in the public sphere for sixty years. She knew exactly what she was doing, and saying ..

Probs used to be very dear friends* with the Mitfords dahling..

*I do know people who say stuff like this, and they are fantastically aware of how to put people down, and in their place, if they don't think those certain people quite 'fit'.

It's not my place to excuse anything, but neither is it my place to condemn it outright without attempting to contextualise and understand it.

If you want to go with the narrative that the palace aide was simply a nasty old racist then the story becomes 'Descendant of slaves visits home of former colonial masters, is treated as such.'
 

Ian H

Guru
Racist?

Insensitive? Yes
Rude? Probably, but hard to tell tone and such from the transcript we have.
Offensive? Well, that's more down to the beholder. I'll delay judgement on that ...

Racist? I'm not seeing anything in the material presented here thus far. She hasn't mistreated the woman because of her race/colour/heritage, or discriminated against her. She's merely been (perhaps overly) curious about someone's background and heritage.

Come off it Matt, that's a completely tone-deaf response. She was effectively refusing to accept Fulani's Britishness, and for very obvious reasons.
 
D

Deleted member 28

Guest
It’s perfectly normal to enquire about a person’s background. It shows you take interest - the unusual accent or their frizzy hair. But I feel the question is often worded badly.

Where you from?

The bold bit is what causes alarm as it suggests you’re not one of us. So, there is an immediate you vs us.

Where is that accent from? Or What is your family heritage? Might be better.

It moves the question away from the individual and to their characteristics.

Is it though, if I was in Newcastle for example and asked that question I would answer Wolverhampton when probably being thought of as being a Brummie.

Would the person be as 'offended' if she was White and of Germanic heritage?
 

Moodyman

Member
Is it though, if I was in Newcastle for example and asked that question I would answer Wolverhampton when probably being thought of as being a Brummie.

Would the person be as 'offended' if she was White and of Germanic heritage?

It’s about context.

As a brown person, would I find the lady’s questioning racist? No, but I might find it uncomfortable.

Would a black person, with the baggage of history in their mind, find it racist? Possibly and understandably.

Would a German? Heck no.
 

icowden

Legendary Member
It’s about context.
I think it's also about the length of the interrogation. Most people would have changed the subject after the first two or three questions when it was fairly clear that this was a poor line of questioning that wasn't going to be answered - instead she seemed to turn it into a full on interrogation.
 
*Sticks head above parapet*

On the surface it does seems like an interrogation, but, we do only have one half of the story and the the Palace aid in question has no opportunity to defend what she said so we can only surmise her intent. The elderly 'posh' can sound very blunt.

I think this is another situation where context and tone are important. Rightly or wrongly I often ask people where they are from as part of casual conversation, I hope I do this in a nice way. Why do I ask? Several reasons really, it helps get people to talk a little about themselves (which I have always been told is generally a good thing to try and do), it may be somewhere where I have been or experienced or know something about and gives us a reference point of discussion, or maybe I know nothing about and am keen to hear more, a starter for 10 if you like. I'm also very curious about other people's culture/beliefs/national backgrounds etc. knowing something about where they come from helps open that discussion. I hope I have never offended anyone by asking. I get frequently asked the same as I travel...once people (men in particular) know I'm from England the next topic is usually football though....
I'm not knowingly selective, it's a regular gambit - it might be somebody with a west-midlands accent, or eastern European, Middle east, or American mid-west....
Usually I end-up having open conversations with random people and learning something to boot.
Am hoping that's not wrong....
 

winjim

Welcome yourself into the new modern crisis
 

matticus

Guru
I think it's also about the length of the interrogation. Most people would have changed the subject after the first two or three questions when it was fairly clear that this was a poor line of questioning that wasn't going to be answered - instead she seemed to turn it into a full on interrogation.

Yeah: rude/insenstive.

Not racist.
 

oldwheels

New Member
At one stage of my life I dealt a lot with Pakistani, Sikh and Indian people. Many of them had very broad Glasgow accents and were second or even third generation living here.
It was a bit strange talking with somebody wearing a green turban with a broad Glasgow accent.
There was a television series probably not on English tv featuring a very Glasgow spoken Sikh chef who habitually wore a kilt.
 

mudsticks

Squire
Racist?

Insensitive? Yes
Rude? Probably, but hard to tell tone and such from the transcript we have.
Offensive? Well, that's more down to the beholder. I'll delay judgement on that ...

Racist? I'm not seeing anything in the material presented here thus far. She hasn't mistreated the woman because of her race/colour/heritage, or discriminated against her. She's merely been (perhaps overly) curious about someone's background and heritage.
Ms Fulani has said she felt the conversation had racist overtones.
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...ack-guest-traumatised-by-repeated-questioning

Even the palace itself has agreed that it did.

Given that ms Fulani was there don't you think we should believe her when she said that's how she felt.
Or shall we right her off (as is some folks wont) as over sensitive..??

It's not my place to excuse anything, but neither is it my place to condemn it outright without attempting to contextualise and understand it.

If you want to go with the narrative that the palace aide was simply a nasty old racist then the story becomes 'Descendant of slaves visits home of former colonial masters, is treated as such.'
The context is that the ms Fulani was made to feel very unwelcome, by someone whose one job, was to welcome people.

To give her her due Lady Hussey has admitted she was wrong and apologised .

I think it's also about the length of the interrogation. Most people would have changed the subject after the first two or three questions when it was fairly clear that this was a poor line of questioning that wasn't going to be answered - instead she seemed to turn it into a full on interrogation.
Exactly, massively tone death interaction (interrogation) by someone, whose whole life has been moving in circles where 'saying the right thing' 'having some manners' (which should include understanding power imbalances in situations) is almost more important than anything else.

She failed at that, has admitted as much , and has now stepped down.
 
OP
OP
Bromptonaut

Bromptonaut

Rohan Man
It was a bit strange talking with somebody wearing a green turban with a broad Glasgow accent.

In Stornoway or Tarbet (Harris) Asian shop and restaurant keepers also speak Gaelic.

Their English has that sort of hybrid of UK and Asian accents you hear in Bradford. No idea if that carries into the Gaelic.
 
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