EU & Brexit Bunker

[briantrumpet]

Meanwhile, the EU thinks the UK should contribute £6bn to give UK companies the ability to sell stuff at a market price to EU countries using its defence fund.

The UK has offered a few hundred million to cover costs.

Yeah, can't say that the noises from the EU are exactly encouraging.

 

[PurplePenguin]

Yeah, can't say that the noises from the EU are exactly encouraging.

Almost another Brexit advantage?

 

[First Aspect]

Almost another Brexit advantage?

Another Brexit almost advantage.

 

[briantrumpet]

This all seems fair analysis. My only hope would be that maybe a decline in polarisation might permit more constructive discussions (unless, of course, if Reform get their way).

https://blogs.lse.ac.uk/europpblog/2025/11/26/has-britain-moved-on-from-brexit/

Brexit may no longer dominate the headlines, but it continues to haunt the political imagination. The EU has become, in many ways, a symbol of unfinished business, not just in trade or regulation but in identity, belonging and Britain’s place in the world.

While our study highlights a clear decline in polarisation and salience, it also underscores the emotional aftershocks that politicisation leaves behind. Apathy, we found, is not the absence of interest in politics – it’s often the residue of overexposure, disillusionment and unmet expectations.

Whether the UK–EU relationship remains in the background or returns to centre stage will likely depend on future crises. But one thing seems clear: Brexit is not something Britons still want to fight over, but it’s also not something they can forget.

 

[briantrumpet]

 

[Psamathe]

Starmer's Reset maybe not going as well as hoped?

Talks for UK to join EU defence fund collapse in blow to Starmer’s bid to reset relations
Keir Starmer’s attempt to reset relations with the EU have suffered a major blow, after negotiations for the UK to join the EU’s flagship €150bn (£131bn) defence fund collapsed.
...
Entrance to the scheme would have enabled the British government to secure a bigger role for its defence firms. In September, France proposed a ceiling on the value of UK-produced military components in the fund.
...

 

[briantrumpet]

Starmer's Reset maybe not going as well as hoped?

Not surprised. Starmer still trying a cake-&-eat-it flavour of reset, and the EU still stubborn negotiators (who knew?) defending members with differing priorities.

 

[briantrumpet]

Not that we'll ever know, but maybe the EU would also have been in a better place had the UK not left. I was of the opinion that the UK could be a PITA as a member, but also a steadying influence in turbulent times. We fucked that up. Obviously I'm not overlooking the fact that Brexiters positively wanted the EU to implode, so they'll look at any dysfunction/chaos as a positive.

 

[Pblakeney]

Not that we'll ever know, but maybe the EU would also have been in a better place had the UK not left. I was of the opinion that the UK could be a PITA as a member, but also a steadying influence in turbulent times. We fucked that up. Obviously I'm not overlooking the fact that Brexiters positively wanted the EU to implode, so they'll look at any dysfunction/chaos as a positive.

View attachment 11346

The main downside for those pro Brexit is that we no longer have a bogeyman to blame.
With sovereignty comes responsibility.

 

[briantrumpet]

The main downside for those pro Brexit is that we no longer have a bogeyman to blame.
With sovereignty comes responsibility.

Oh, they still blame the EU just for not having moved away from the other side of the Channel, and people with brown skin, just for being, well, brown.

 

[briantrumpet]

Here's the full article

https://archive.ph/X9Wpb

Getting Brexit over the line required an unholy alliance of different groups and interests with often strongly divergent views on what they wished to achieve.

Small state, low tax, free trade libertarians do not make natural bedfellows for anti-immigrant, nationalistic protectionists, yet this was the coalition required to give Brexit its majority. In the event, Brexit has failed to enable either of these two conflicting visions. Instead, we’ve ended up with the worst of both worlds. Substantially higher public spending and taxes go hand in hand with a regulatory burden that almost unbelievably makes business leaders long for the comparative freedoms once enjoyed within the European Union. If Brexit was meant to tame immigration, in practice it has done the very reverse. Nobody voted for the Boriswave – yet this is what freedom to set our own border controls delivered.

Still, at least we’ve been able to negotiate our own trade deals. That must be worth something, mustn’t it? Sadly, the impact is judged by the OBR to be too insignificant to qualify as a meaningful positive for medium term economic growth. Lest it be thought the OBR is being deliberately unhelpful, its judgement is based on the Government’s own internal assessment of the benefits, which economists consider to be at best marginal.

If Brexit was supposed to be a moment of national economic renewal, it has comprehensively failed to deliver as it was supposed to. Maybe the OBR is being too pessimistic in downgrading its medium term forecast for productivity growth to just 1pc a year – but even with the wonders of AI, I wouldn’t bank on it.
Despite the downgrade, it is at the top end of most outside assessments and may therefore prove too optimistic.

Ironically, the one thing Brexit has delivered is an old-school Labour Government intent in its high-tax, high-spend ambitions on making us more like Europe, not less so. Plus ça change, plus c’est la même chose.

 

[PurplePenguin]

Previously you said

Yeah, can't say that the noises from the EU are exactly encouraging.

But then you have defaulted back to this.

Not surprised. Starmer still trying a cake-&-eat-it flavour of reset, and the EU still stubborn negotiators (who knew?) defending members with differing priorities.

I've seen very few commentators outside of the French defence industry who think the EU is playing this well. Irrespective of whether the UK benefits, the primary objective is to improve the EU's defence capability and most think this isn't the way to do that. That said, some suggest it doesn't make that much difference to the UK which is why the UK is only willing to cover some admin costs of the fund.

It is possible to criticise the EU. It's not even that difficult.

 

[The Crofted Crest]

Brexit required the complete abandonment of economic and political reality, stepping out of the wardrobe and into the sunlit uplands. It has only revealed the poverity of the ruling class and the ignorance of the voting class.

 

[briantrumpet]

Previously you said

But then you have defaulted back to this.

I've seen very few commentators outside of the French defence industry who think the EU is playing this well. Irrespective of whether the UK benefits, the primary objective is to improve the EU's defence capability and most think this isn't the way to do that. That said, some suggest it doesn't make that much difference to the UK which is why the UK is only willing to cover some admin costs of the fund.

It is possible to criticise the EU. It's not even that difficult.

I am gently criticising them (maybe buried in my "with differing priorities" and "would be in a better place") at the same time as recognising what it's like. There are never not going to be tensions within the EU, and, as I suggest, I think it would have been better with the UK in it helping it navigate choppy waters.

 

[briantrumpet]

Stewart Lee with a pungent simile