Gender again. Sorry!

[monkers]

Perhaps you could add 'bra fitter' to your imaginary careers list and help him out.

Well let's have a look at what you have said in open hostility. You've said that Sex Matters are a human rights organisation. That is not so, if they were they would be advocating for the human rights of all people - they don't. They are an organisation that exist to campaign for the removal of the human rights of their target group - in effect they are the opposite of Stonewall.

Trans women do not have ''moobs''. This is both hostile and false. Trans women develop breasts in the same way as cis women do - in response to hormones. They develop breast material, not fat. ''Moobs'' can to be made to lactate.

The assertion of coercion of the bra fitter is false. The assertion that the bra fitter will be ''forced'' to handle anything is false.

Yes, I have breasts, and yes I have had bra fitting. No that does not make me a bra fitter. There's never been any fuss either way, and no bra fitter has touched my breasts.

Your posts demonstrate exactly the reason that trans people need protection.

 

[monkers]

The supreme court isn't obliged to hear from anybody who wants to chip in, especially individuals. You only get to intervene if you are raising significant points of law. There's no right to intervene just because the outcome might affect you.

The Scottish government and Amnesty International were there to put the case and argued exactly the same points that an anecdotal account from McCloud would have done. There are standards to meet to be an intervenor and McCloud failed to reach them.

View attachment 9586 McCloud has zero consideration for women's rights or feelings. There are additional unisex spaces, specialist trans rape provision, and it's an impingement on female police officers rights to have to conduct body searches on men.

Your language speaks volumes about your mindset.

Dr Victoria McCloud is not only a trans woman but a former High Court judge. You think she does not understand how the court system works?

She could have brought life experience and legal clarity.

The scales are the actual symbol of the legal authority of the judiciary. They symbolise balance. On this occasion there was little in the way of balance. The role of the advocate for the Scottish Ministers was not to assist trans women or even to assist the justices in this hearing, it was to defend the position of the Scottish Ministers who, somewhat ironically, had taken advice from the EHRC.

''Two sexes at once'' is a well-observed legal position. Trans women under the law, but now unprotected from discrimination in their legal identity.

Faulkner even declared openly that they don't think that the human rights of privacy and dignity apply to trans people.

 

[AuroraSaab]

Well let's have a look at what you have said in open hostility. You've said that Sex Matters are a human rights organisation. That is not so, if they were they would be advocating for the human rights of all people - they don't.

The Dogs Trust don't care about cats, Age Concern aren't bothered about little kids, and Black Lives Matters isn't about white people. Groups are allowed to advocate for their specific interests.

They are an organisation that exist to campaign for the removal of the human rights of their target group - in effect they are the opposite of Stonewall.

No, they advocate for women's rights, specifically to promote clarity in law, policy, and language in areas where sex matters. They have as much right to campaign on their chosen issues as any other group. There are many trans activist organisations which centre only the wants of trans identifying people, as is their right.

 

[AuroraSaab]

Your language speaks volumes about your mindset.

Dr Victoria McCloud is not only a trans woman but a former High Court judge. You think she does not understand how the court system works?

She could have brought life experience and legal clarity.

So could a million other people. The court is not obliged to listen to everybody whose life experience is relevant.

 

[monkers]

The Dogs Trust don't care about cats, Age Concern aren't bothered about little kids, and Black Lives Matters isn't about white people. Groups are allowed to advocate for their specific interests.




No, they advocate for women's rights, specifically to promote clarity in law, policy, and language in areas where sex matters. They have as much right to campaign on their chosen issues as any other group. There are many trans activist organisations which centre only the wants of trans identifying people, as is their right.

Does the Dogs Trust campaign against cats - what do they say about cats? Do they say that only dogs can have animal rights?

Black Lives matter do not argue that white people should be discriminated against - they are not hostile to white people. They are a long marginalised group who just seek just and equal treatment.

I'm sure that Age Concern are bothered about little kids, however they are a special interest group with respect to elders - they do not campaign to have children discriminated against.

Sex Matters actively campaign against the rights of trans people especially trans women, that does not make them human rights advocates.

Your open hostility on the forums screams that you want trans women removed from society and the services they need.

On the occasions that you've been asked to stand up your claims about trans women - you have always failed.

 

[monkers]

So could a million other people. The court is not obliged to listen to everybody whose life experience is relevant.

Neither could the court hear from the 35 million or so women and girls in this country - that is why democracy is a representative model - the judiciary is an essential part of that.

Having complained extensively about some gender critical women being silenced, you are also advocating that your 'enemies' - for that is how you portray them - to be silenced. Gender critical women have never been silenced by the judiciary.

 

[AuroraSaab]

Thanks for confirming that anything that gives women rights to single sex spaces is 'anti trans'. Seems a very misogynistic view.

Neither have trans people been silenced. McCloud and Whittle simply had to make their case to be allowed to intervene the same as others did. There's no automatic right. They failed to make a case.

For years on here you've pontificated about what the law means and how it must be follwed. Now the law has been clarified you don't like it. You're free to campaign to change it of course.

Funny how people change their tune.

 

[monkers]

For years on here you've pontificated about what the law means and how it must be follwed. Now the law has been clarified you don't like it. You're free to campaign to change it of course.

Actually I haven't.

 

[monkers]

Thanks for confirming that anything that gives women rights to single sex spaces is 'anti trans'. Seems a very misogynistic view.

Neither have trans people been silenced. McCloud and Whittle simply had to make their case to be allowed to intervene the same as others did. There's no automatic right. They failed to make a case.

For years on here you've pontificated about what the law means and how it must be follwed. Now the law has been clarified you don't like it. You're free to campaign to change it of course.

Funny how people change their tune.

View attachment 9587

Joe Maugham is correct.

 

[monkers]

Neither have trans people been silenced. McCloud and Whittle simply had to make their case to be allowed to intervene the same as others did. There's no automatic right. They failed to make a case.

The Supreme Court hold it within their gift who they should hear from in order to reach a balanced view. That does not prevent criticism that they seem to have been reluctant to hear from both sides - which after all is the standard practice.

You can not reasonably argue that they failed to make a case when they were denied the opportunity to make a case. Please do stop talking in riddles - it just creates work.

 

[CXRAndy]

They did hear from both sides, it's just that you didn't like to line up of the team for trans

Birth characteristics are mostly incidental or accidental

There is no accident in birth characteristics, the parents DNA determine them

 

[AuroraSaab]

You can not reasonably argue that they failed to make a case when they were denied the opportunity to make a case. Please do stop talking in riddles - it just creates work.

You know exactly what was meant. They failed to make their case that they should be allowed to intervene. I don't know whether McCloud or Whittles's application had any merit or not because as far as I know they haven't published it. Perhaps they should and we can speculate on why the court felt their intervention would add nothing that wasn't already to be covered.

 

[classic33]

They did hear from both sides, it's just that you didn't like to line up of the team for trans



There is no accident in birth characteristics, the parents DNA determine them

Which parent determines the sex of a baby?​

As females carry XX sex chromosomes, all of their egg cells will contain an X sex chromosome. Because males carry XY sex chromosomes, 50% of their sperm cells will contain an X sex chromosome and the other 50% will contain a Y sex chromosome.

If a sperm with an X sex chromosome fertilises the egg cell containing an X chromosome, the baby will be female (XX). If a sperm with an Y sex chromosome fertilises the egg cell containing an X chromosome, the baby will be male (XY) and therefore it is the father’s sperm cell that determines the gender of the baby.

https://www.alphabiolabs.co.uk/learning-centre/which-parent-determines-the-sex-of-a-baby/

You're saying that the fathers sperm know which one is going to fertilise the egg!

 

[CXRAndy]

Glad we've cleared that up humans are born either male or female

 

[classic33]

Glad we've cleared that up humans are born either male or female

To answer this question in an uncontroversial way, you’d have to first get everyone to agree on what counts as intersex — and also to agree on what should count as strictly male or strictly female.

https://isna.org/faq/frequency/


An estimated 1 in 2,000 children born each year are neither boy nor girl — they are intersex, part of a group of about 60 conditions that fall under the diagnosis of disorders of sexual development (DSD). Once called hermaphrodites, from the handsome Greek god who had dual sexuality, they are now known as intersex.
https://scienceoxygen.com/how-many-real-hermaphrodites-are-there/