Reform, and the death of the Tory Party

[Pinno718]

... and Ed Davey prefers stupid stunts to serious politics too much of the time, where should those who feel left behind turn?

No one on here (or in the traditional parties) really is coming up with many solutions.

Getting fair media coverage seems nigh on impossible so he resorted to 'stupid stunts'. Anyway, the stupid stunts gained many seats.

 

[TailWindHome]

The difference being he also blamed the last four plumbers and then promised that he could fix it. It's not like he accidentally fell into being the PM and found himself having to sort out a massive problem that he wasn't aware of. He actively campaigned for the job in the full knowledge that the nation's finances were in a terrible state. It's probably his lifetime's ambition to be Prime Minister and then as soon as he gets the job he's found himself wanting.

That doesn't contradict what I posted in any way tbh

The first 4 plumbers promised they'd fix it

The 6th plumber will want to be a plumber too

 

[Shortfall]

But what solutions are the traditional parties offering to help steer people away from Reform?
I think Reform would be terrible, but given people consider the Tories failed, Labour are failing, the greens are nutters and Ed Davey prefers stupid stunts to serious politics too much of the time, where should those who feel left behind turn?

No one on here (or in the traditional parties) really is coming up with many solutions.

Yeah it's like they're looking at the state of the country and saying " Its not our fault, a big boy did it and ran away". It probably doesn't help their case to call the people looking at an alternative thick, racist b@stards either. I know it sounds radical but maybe they could look at finding some solutions for these disaffected voters?

 

[Shortfall]

That doesn't contradict what I posted in any way tbh
The 6th plumber will want to be a plumber too

He could just suck air through his teeth and say it was beyond repair and tell the customer that if he wants it sorting them he needs completely new plumbing that will involve a lot of expense and take a very long time.

 

[TailWindHome]

He could just suck air through his teeth and say it was beyond repair and tell the customer that if he wants it sorting them he needs completely new plumbing that will involve a lot of expense and take a very long time.

The customer didn't like that diagnosis

Phoning Honest Nige for a quote instead

 

[TailWindHome]

A plumber may not be enough to clear this jobby

 

[Dorset Boy]

Getting fair media coverage seems nigh on impossible so he resorted to 'stupid stunts'. Anyway, the stupid stunts gained many seats.

Except the stupid stunts didn't.
ABTT is what gained them seats.

 

[Shortfall]

The customer didn't like that diagnosis

Phoning Honest Nige for a quote instead

And that folks is why we are where we are. Nobody wants the truth.

 

[Stevo 666]

Because you have to measure against something. You say Labour are performing badly but offer no evidence or yardstick by which to prove your statement.

Therefore it's just a pointless opinion.

For example, opinion polls say that people don't believe Labour is doing a great job with the economy.
Actual data shows that since they took power the economy is showing modest but patchy recovery.

The "public"s perception of the Government is coloured by reporting in the heavily biased dead tree media, and that which they read on social media - which is also often heavily biased.

So - where is your evidence and what are you measuring against? You criticise Reeves but she hasn't crashed the economy. Consumer confidence levels are improving amongst the younger generations. It's the miserable old gits that aren't moveable in their opinions (as has ever been the case).

I'm not interested in whataboutery. Feel free to defend Labour and explain why they're doing a cracking job, despite the polls, the piss poor economic growth, the shrinking job vacancies, rising tax burden, crisis in the hospitality industry, etc etc.

Your defence of Reeves is that she hasn't crashed the economy. Hardly a ringing endorsement.

As for blaming it on the nasty right wing media, never heard that one before Surely there are a few left leaning media outlets who could sing their praises?

 

[briantrumpet]

"More poor children in return for cheaper beer" is quite a bold policy choice.

 

[Stevo 666]

"More poor children in return for cheaper beer" is quite a bold policy choice.

View attachment 12836

Could be quite popular though.

 

[icowden]

I'm not interested in whataboutery. Feel free to defend Labour and explain why they're doing a cracking job, despite the polls, the piss poor economic growth, the shrinking job vacancies, rising tax burden, crisis in the hospitality industry, etc etc.

Isn't that what you are doing? I'm not doing the research to justify your opinion. That's your job.

Your defence of Reeves is that she hasn't crashed the economy. Hardly a ringing endorsement.

It's better than Trussonomics.

 

[midlandsgrimpeur]

And that folks is why we are where we are. Nobody wants the truth.

Doesn't that contradict your argument though? You are saying (not without merit) that people are disaffected and sick of being lied to by the political establishment. On the other hand though, they don't want the hard truths about how a country needs to be run in order for there to be a better services, greater economic prosperity and so on.

You can's ask to be told what you want to hear then be surprised when it turns out you have been lied to.

The only real solution to any of this is for a Political party to set out its manifesto and then actually try to deliver it (assuming it is the govt of the time). Then at least you die by the sword. The major problem it seems (from both Labour and previous Tory govts) is the lack of actual governing. Labour themselves have flip flopped on so many policies it is embarrassing.

We as the electorate have to take some level of blame in all of this, we want a govt to tell us what will make us better off as individuals and don't want to suffer any personal hardship as a result, rather than accepting that the overall collective good sometimes means we don't always benefit. As long as we ask our politicians to lie to us, many of them will.

 

[briantrumpet]

And that folks is why we are where we are. Nobody wants the truth.

It's a collective cowardice of politicians, but based on the fact that the electorate rewards fibbers time after time. Stephen Fry hits the nail on the head:

 

[Stevo 666]

Isn't that what you are doing? I'm not doing the research to justify your opinion. That's your job.


It's better than Trussonomics.

Your deny the reality of any of those? - they pretty self evident. Here's a few basics to help you pull your head out of the sand:-
Growth in 2025:
While initial growth was robust at 0.7% in Q1, it slowed to 0.1% in Q3 due to weaker manufacturing and a, as reported in the Office for National Statistics 2025 bulletins.

Job vacancies in 2025:
"Key 2025 UK Job Market Trends

• Vacancy Levels: Vacancies remained broadly flat in late 2025, sitting around 729,000 to 734,000, which is significantly lower than the record highs seen in 2022.
• Sector Declines: Vacancies dropped in 13 to 16 out of 18 industry sectors by the end of 2025, with significant declines in wholesale/retail and health/social work.
• Unemployment Rate: The number of unemployed people per vacancy rose, reaching 2.5 in late 2025, up from 1.8 the previous year, indicating a tighter job market for job seekers."

Tax burden in 2025 - NI rise says it all. Business rates hike is very well publicised.

Labour polls performance: Do I really need to post evidence for this?

As for Trussonomics, I've already said I'm not interested in what aboutery. Did you not read that?

Anyway, please can you now justify why you think Labour are doing a great job and we should all vote for them (assuming they allow us to do that).