RIP Ann Widdecome

[spen666]

FWIW, I'm not looking for all the facts. I just find the story baffling as it has been presented.
Possibly a failing on my part but everything just seems disjointed. Possibly a failure of the reporting.

Not sure there is a failing of reporting.

The media are limited to what they can legally publish. You will have to wait until the trial to get a more complete picture

Its a failing of the public in having expectations that cannot legally be satisfied

 

[spen666]

There are so many questions people would like answered in this case - me included.

Hopefully those will become apparent after a trial has concluded.

It is important that there is a fair trial and that is the most important issue now

 

[monkers]

There are so many questions people would like answered in this case - me included.

Hopefully those will become apparent after a trial has concluded.

It is important that there is a fair trial and that is the most important issue now

I think you are quite correct to advocate caution. It's easy in the age of the internet for people to forget that 'flooding the zone' on social media or other media makes the task of the court to find untainted jurors for a fair trial all the more difficult.

 

[Milzy]

The sick thing is MSM won’t talk about Anne’s murder because it came from the far left. If it was from the far right they’d be milking it for months.

 

[AndyRM]

The sick thing is MSM won’t talk about Anne’s murder because it came from the far left. If it was from the far right they’d be milking it for months.

That's absolute bollocks and you know it.

 

[Rusty Nails]

That's absolute bollocks and you know it.

Normal for Milzy.

 

[FishFright]

I used to love political discussion with those on the right , usually about policy and the nature of freedom ( freedom from vs freedom to ) . But now those on the right just post nonsense they picked up from social media and believe those posts constitute evidence.
What went wrong ?

 

[midlandsgrimpeur]

I used to love political discussion with those on the right , usually about policy and the nature of freedom ( freedom from vs freedom to ) . But now those on the right just post nonsense they picked up from social media and believe those posts constitute evidence.
What went wrong ?

I think in the main it has been the widespread importation of right wing US political discourse, fuelled by social media and abetted by Russian bots. A big part of the floodgates opening to enable this was the Brexit campaign and aftermath.

 

[spen666]

I used to love political discussion with those on the right , usually about policy and the nature of freedom ( freedom from vs freedom to ) . But now those on the right just post nonsense they picked up from social media and believe those posts constitute evidence.
What went wrong ?

This sort of attitude is what went wrong

Seeking to blame your opponents for all that is wrong. There are numerous on the left of politics who do exactly the same, but you do not see that.

There is no debate as everyone seems to have entrenched views and seek to post any old nonsense from social media to "back up" their position
Also on both sides people seem to have forgotten politics should be about what is best for the country, instead it has become what is best for the political party or faction of a party they support.

Any idea or comment from the other side has to be trashed, even if it would be better for the country

Politics has become about supporting your tribe, not about what is good for the country. It has become like football where anything your side does is to be praised or defended and anything the opposition does or says is immediately attacked. Witness the 85k+ signatures on a petition in Argentina demanding the World Cup Final be replayed because the referee was "corrupt" against Argentina - ignoring their players thuggish behaviour etc

 

[FishFright]

This sort of attitude is what went wrong

Seeking to blame your opponents for all that is wrong. There are numerous on the left of politics who do exactly the same, but you do not see that.

There is no debate as everyone seems to have entrenched views and seek to post any old nonsense from social media to "back up" their position
Also on both sides people seem to have forgotten politics should be about what is best for the country, instead it has become what is best for the political party or faction of a party they support.

Any idea or comment from the other side has to be trashed, even if it would be better for the country

Politics has become about supporting your tribe, not about what is good for the country. It has become like football where anything your side does is to be praised or defended and anything the opposition does or says is immediately attacked. Witness the 85k+ signatures on a petition in Argentina demanding the World Cup Final be replayed because the referee was "corrupt" against Argentina - ignoring their players thuggish behaviour etc

You never fail to let me down with your whatabouttery

 

[briantrumpet]

I used to love political discussion with those on the right , usually about policy and the nature of freedom ( freedom from vs freedom to ) . But now those on the right just post nonsense they picked up from social media and believe those posts constitute evidence.
What went wrong ?

Boris Johnson & Brexit. They untethered the party from pragmatism, honesty and logic.

 

[spen666]

You never fail to let me down with your whatabouttery

there you go attack the person

Not a single attempt to debate the points made.

There is no whatabouterry in my post, merely a direct answer of my opinion why debate ceases to exist.

 

[Rusty Nails]

there you go attack the person

Not a single attempt to debate the points made.

There is no whatabouterry in my post, merely a direct answer of my opinion why debate ceases to exist.

My problem with debating the points you make is that they are all anodyne clichés, that are inarguable but move us forwards not one inch in how to resolve them

Of course everyone should be fair to each other and listen to their opponents' arguments but that doesn't help explain what to do when you listen and still find no areas of agreement. I don't dislike some politicians because they are right wing but because I don't agree with or like the right wing policies or actions they espouse. You say that people should support the policies that are best for the country, but isn't the essence of our adversarial system of politics in this country that politicians and voters strongly disagree about what is best for the country.

On the topic of attacking the person what do you think of the responses of some forum members who can hardly post anything that doesn't include the term Lefty as a pejorative.

 

[monkers]

Also on both sides people seem to have forgotten politics should be about what is best for the country

Is it the people forgetting? I'm old enough to remember when candidates for the parties had their own manifesto pledges - now they don't.

Further I remember something about MPs having a duty to serve the constituency, the nation, the party, and their own conscience. Perhaps rather than people forgetting, they now understand that the party whip prevents all of that. And further to that, interviewees tend to say ''I'm voting for Farage (for example) regardless of where their own constituency might be.

I'm also a bit more cynical perhaps than I should be, but I notice that culture war has an effect - creating a tribe centred around a fear causes a higher turn out of voters to that cause. As a result rather than voting in their own interests, they vote against the interests of those they dislike. I think there are a lot of single issue voters out there.

 

[FishFright]

there you go attack the person

Not a single attempt to debate the points made.

There is no whatabouterry in my post, merely a direct answer of my opinion why debate ceases to exist.

You should read your posts .