Starmer's vision quest

[Stevo 666]

Some people celebrated saying that they'd put their Truss tax cut bonanza into turning their central heating up. Not sure that that was going to trickle down anywhere.

Not sure you've quite grasped the trickle down concept.

 

[icowden]

So why is she saying she needs to leave the UK. It is either because she is tax resident here and needs to change that, or because she is about to become tax resident based on number of days here and needs to avoid it. Either way, we lose out.

Hmmm... lets do some basic research.
The article is on MSN but was published in the Telegraph. Is this a reliable news source? Well it routinely publishes paid for articles as news, as well as articles that are completely made up in order to promote the agenda of the editor.

So that's a firm NO then.

The article is supplied by her company, so it's just a puff piece for her that she has had published in the Telegraph (and a. It doesn't even make sense. She says that if Reeves doesn't reverse the IHT changes she will go home to South Africa but then says she will probably invest in Europe instead of the UK. If her reason for investing in the UK was that she lives here now, it doesn't make any sense to live in SA and then invest in Europe. Also she left in 2019 after speaking out against Zuma, but now she's going to go back?

Her main complaint seems to be that if she lives in the UK for more than 10 years then IHT gets applied to her offshore assets, so her son will only inherit many hundreds of millions and might not be a billionaire any more.

Oh, boo hoo.

 

[C R]

Not sure you've quite grasped the trickle down concept.

Personally I'm not a fan of watersports, particularly not the kind of watersports that trickle down encourages. But you do you.

 

[Stevo 666]

Personally I'm not a fan of watersports, particularly not the kind of watersports that trickle down encourages. But you do you.

Great counter argument there 🙂

 

[bobzmyunkle]

Must be all those millionaires leaving (including the ones that don't actually live here)
https://www.cityam.com/uk-suffers-second-highest-fall-in-wealth-of-any-major-economy-in-2024/

 

[briantrumpet]

It's a novel concept that well-off people turning up their central heating because of tax cuts to the well-off is going to benefit the less well-off. I'm not wholly convinced, I'll admit.

 

[Stevo 666]

Hmmm... lets do some basic research.
The article is on MSN but was published in the Telegraph. Is this a reliable news source? Well it routinely publishes paid for articles as news, as well as articles that are completely made up in order to promote the agenda of the editor.

So that's a firm NO then.

The article is supplied by her company, so it's just a puff piece for her. It doesn't even make sense. She says that if Reeves doesn't reverse the IHT changes she will go home to South Africa but then says she will probably invest in Europe instead of the UK. If her reason for investing in the UK was that she lives here now, it doesn't make any sense to live in SA and then invest in Europe. Also she left in 2019 after speaking out against Zuma, but now she's going to go back?

Her main argument is that if she dies, it may be difficult for her son to liquidate shares in South Africa to pay the tax. SHe owns a Flat in Holland Park and a House SOmewhere. The flat could be worth 17 million. Lets say the house is about the same. 50 million. Her son will have to find £20 million.

Her shares in Sygnia are worth £1.7bn. DO you *really* think it will be a problem for her son to find £20mil?

Whether her kids can actually find the money is not relevant.

Let me explain again under both possible scenarios.
1. She is UK tax resident and is leaving to avoid a significant future IHT bill. Simple enough as we then lose the tax revenue
2. She is not UK tax resident but as mentioned in the article, she is counting the days that she can stay in the UK without becoming UK tax resident and will leave before she breaches that threshold. In that case, we get no tax revenue, but if she had stayed then she would become UK tax resident and we would get tax revenue from her. So it then is an opportunity cost.

Pick which scenario you think applies based on what you've read and let us know. It's one or the other, unless you're going to provide some evidence that she is lying.

 

[icowden]

2. She is not UK tax resident but as mentioned in the article, she is counting the days that she can stay in the UK without becoming UK tax resident and will leave before she breaches that threshold. In that case, we get no tax revenue, but if she had stayed then she would become UK tax resident and we would get tax revenue from her. So it then is an opportunity cost.

You missed one out .

3. She is not UK tax resident for several years and is trying to use her wealth and position to influence government policy for personal gain, but has no interest in leaving the UK at all, although her tax advisors have advised her that she will preserve more wealth by leaving.

 

[BoldonLad]

It's a novel concept that well-off people turning up their central heating because of tax cuts to the well-off is going to benefit the less well-off. I'm not wholly convinced, I'll admit.

It's a novel concept that any "well-off" person actually said it, but, I think we have established, people are illogical.

It can go in the same file as:

"I give my WFA to the grandkids for Christmas"

"I buy a good bottle of wine with my WFA"

etc etc

People talk shite, accept it 😂

 

[C R]

Great counter argument there 🙂

I know, I'm at the intellectual level of Truss and Kwarteng here.

 

[BoldonLad]

This article (BBC) https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cx2kym1pvn4o suggests that all households in receipt of means tested benefits will receive a £150 discount off their energy bills. Isn't Child Benefit a Means Tested benefit? I think the estimate of 2.7million homes is a bit low.

 

[secretsqirrel]

This article (BBC) https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cx2kym1pvn4o suggests that all households in receipt of means tested benefits will receive a £150 discount off their energy bills. Isn't Child Benefit a Means Tested benefit? I think the estimate of 2.7million homes is a bit low.

No child benefit is not means tested.

 

[laurentian]

No child benefit is not means tested.

. . . although there is a High Income Child Benefit Charge (HICBC) where households with a high-earning individual (earning £60,000 or more) may have to repay some or all of the benefit through the tax system.

 

[Pblakeney]

Re economists, if they are as smart as they think they are then they would all be able to retire after 10 years but they don’t. So….? 🤔

 

[AuroraSaab]

This article (BBC) https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cx2kym1pvn4o suggests that all households in receipt of means tested benefits will receive a £150 discount off their energy bills. Isn't Child Benefit a Means Tested benefit? I think the estimate of 2.7million homes is a bit low.

Do tax credits /universal credit count for this purpose? That's about 6 million. There's about 2 million people on housing benefit (might also be on universal credit too obvs).