Adam4868
Legendary Member
Should we be surprised ?
https://www.theguardian.com/news/20...xposes-financial-secrets-of-rich-and-powerful
https://www.theguardian.com/news/20...xposes-financial-secrets-of-rich-and-powerful
The Pandora Papers.
- Thread starter Adam4868
- Start date
Bromptonaut
Rohan Man
- Location
- Bugbrooke, Northants
No.
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OP
OP
Adam4868
Legendary Member
Hopefully Blair will be quite for a while....before he lectures us again.
mudsticks
Legendary Member
Not surprised, at all.
But we should still be mightily p***d off, and dare to say so..
But then, how long before someone comes along to tell you you're doing 'politics of envy'???
pubrunner
New Member
Yes, 'ordinary' people should complain about the use of various legal loopholes, which effectively mean that government debt increases, government investment has to be less and 'normal' people have to pay more tax.
Where does this leak go from here, what will be done with the information ?
Realistically, there'll be a week of finger pointing, comments about pigs in the trough etc, and by next week it will pass. There is zero appetite in governments around the world for global tax laws that would close loopholes, so nothing will change. Out of self-interest, those with the power to stop this kind of chicanery, won't.
An example is given of Tony and Cherie Blair, who avoided shelling out on £312,000 in stamp duty, because they bought a property’s holding company rather than the building directly. Whilst there is no evidence that the Blairs did anything illegal, in his first speech as Labour leader, Blair criticised 'millionaires with the right accountants who pay nothing' in tax and promised to 'create a tax system that is fair, which is related to ability to pay'.
Even if whаt the Blаirs did wаs perfectly legаl аnd legitimаte in the business world, it feels inherently unfаir, becаuse they hаve аccess to аn аdvаntаge – а potentiаl аdvаntаge – thаt the rest of us don't, as most people аre incаpаble of doing the sаme thing.
It appears to serve the purposes of our government (and previous ones) to ignore this sort of thing. Perhaps, so they can be like Tony Blair (and David Cameron) and take advantage of it themselves later on.
As Prime Minister, Blair called the British tax system - 'a haven of scams, perks, City deals, and profits', but the Blairs have done very well from it themselves - their wealth runs into the tens of millions - when will they have 'enough' ?
The Blairs avoided paying £312,000 in Stamp Duty . . . which is significantly more than I paid for my house. But for me, it isn't about 'politics of envy', but rather, railing against massive wealth, much of it hidden away (unused & untaxed) and the sheer hypocrisy of those who cling onto such vast fortunes.
BoldonLad
Old man on a bike. Not a member of a clique.
- Location
- South Tyneside
Nothing we didn’t already know. Didn’t the Milibands pull some (legal) stunt to avoid inheritance tax when their father died?
Bromptonaut
Rohan Man
- Location
- Bugbrooke, Northants
After Ralph Miliband died his widow created a deed of family arrangement. Its effect was to vary the late Professor's will so that rather than being left wholly to her 40% was split equally between his sons. Although David and Ed were probably parties they were not required to be; Mrs M could have done it off her own bat.
It somewhat backfired as David subsequently bought the whole gaff from his Mother and Ed was liable CGT on his share.
BoldonLad
Old man on a bike. Not a member of a clique.
- Location
- South Tyneside
Yes, that is the incident I mentioned.
All perfectly legal of course, I am sure, but, perhaps, not behaviour you would expect from them.
Archie_tect
Active Member
You can't stop your mother from doing things you wish she wouldn't.... oh no.
Well I couldn't.
Well I couldn't.
qigong chimp
Well-Known Member
Regrettably skipdiverjohn hasn't made it over to keep us straight on who the real scroungers are.
No representation without taxation has to be the way forward.
No representation without taxation has to be the way forward.
Milkfloat
Active Member
Whilst we are governed by so many of those who stand to gain from such ‘unethical’ dealings and those who want to be in a position to benefit from such ‘unethical dealings’ nothing will change. The richest will get richer on the backs of the middle and lowest paid and the middle will dream that one day they can do the same. I am sure this has gone on for centuries and will continue for centuries more.
Rusty Nails
Upright Member
Strangely, I don't feel unduly outraged by all this.
Apparently we are definitely lower league when it comes to financial skullduggery in the international championships.
The foreign corruption we can do nothing about and Blair, Milliband and Cameron are definitely out of order, but their greed was not illegal, and compared to corrupt leaders we still lag behind other democracies like France, Italy and Israel, and even the US with Trump's tax issues.
I have not seen the full list of leaks in this document.
Apparently we are definitely lower league when it comes to financial skullduggery in the international championships.
The foreign corruption we can do nothing about and Blair, Milliband and Cameron are definitely out of order, but their greed was not illegal, and compared to corrupt leaders we still lag behind other democracies like France, Italy and Israel, and even the US with Trump's tax issues.
I have not seen the full list of leaks in this document.
OP
OP
Adam4868
Legendary Member
So your not bothered because we're not the worst....but you haven't read it
Feel better allready
Rusty Nails
Upright Member
So your not bothered because we're not the worst....but you haven't read it
Feel better allready
Not unduly bothered, which is not quite the same thing.
I was honest that I hadn't read it in the hope that people like you who clearly have would give more info to prove me wrong.
Are there any other UK leaders on it other than Blair, or do you reserve your opprobrium for him?
