What is the point of prison?

[BoldonLad]

The moral/ ethical code before criminality is entirely down to parental influence and control... and what we, ie you and I, would remember as the triumvirate of parents/ teachers and the local bobby coordinating and agreeing on acceptable behaviour and setting boundaries.

It is the need to set clear boundaries of acceptable behaviour that we have to set for children - now parents might take their child's side rather than agree with a teacher when there is a disciplinary concern about inappropriate behaviour early one... children always push boundaries- it's up to us as parents/ grandparents and the immediate local community to set standards of what is or isn't acceptable. I realise in this day and age discipline is a problem because some children in some neighbourhoods don't get much parental or community input... difficult isn't it, but if we want to provide the kind of support that we, ie you and I, used to get it's a necessary and vital task. I would suggest most children and parents are good at it.

Amazing, and not a mention of Government or Funding, I think I could quote that post to a roomful of Gammons, and, get a standing ovation

Don't disagree you by the way.

Parenting is difficult, none of us have previous experience, there are no action replays available, by the time you have learned (often from your mistakes) the task (and the damage) is done.

Witnessed a fine bit of parenting today, whilst cycling through Washington:

Woman (mother and/or wife/partner?) pushing pram along street, hurling verbal abuse (including a few obscenities) at man, walking ahead (father? and/or husband/partner). Child, in pram clapping his/her hands. Tomorrows problem.

 

[Cirrus]

The moral/ ethical code before criminality is entirely down to parental influence and control.

I dare say that it is, but it will depend upon how tightly a parent/s wants to control who their child is friends with. In my opinion, a person's peer group can have a huge impact on a child's future and whether they go on to offend or not.

 

[Archie_tect]

Amazing, and not a mention of Government or Funding, I think I could quote that post to a roomful of Gammons, and, get a standing ovation

Don't disagree you by the way.

Parenting is difficult, none of us have previous experience, there are no action replays available, by the time you have learned (often from your mistakes) the task (and the damage) is done.

Witnessed a fine bit of parenting today, whilst cycling through Washington:

Woman (mother and/or wife/partner?) pushing pram along street, hurling verbal abuse (including a few obscenities) at man, walking ahead (father? and/or husband/partner). Child, in pram clapping his/her hands. Tomorrows problem.

Ah, but you fail to highlight that the local bobby is the head of the triumvirate of parent/ educator and enforcer... the ultimate joint arbiters of what is stepping over the line... the one the parents use as a bogeyman to scare the bejesus out of their children... it was joined up society at work and it would be so easy to recreate the same... that's where adequate funding of the police comes in... every neighbourhood should have it's own bobby or two working with their communities, setting a moral and ethical standard of behaviour.

That was easy...

 

[Archie_tect]

I dare say that it is, but it will depend upon how tightly a parent/s wants to control who their child is friends with. In my opinion, a person's peer group can have a huge impact on a child's future and whether they go on to offend or not.

That is the moral dilemma... soft cop/ hard cop... every child needs achievable and clear boundaries. Parenting is hard work, young children don't have the skills to set what's right or wrong- that's where parents and their immediate neighbours and communities need to establish rules which everyone sticks to and enforces consistently and fairly.

 

[Unkraut]

Parenting is difficult, none of us have previous experience, there are no action replays available, by the time you have learned (often from your mistakes) the task (and the damage) is done.

All your faults are so faithfully reproduced.

 

[BoldonLad]

All your faults are so faithfully reproduced.

In my case, I can (almost) squirm out of that one, only one of my 6 are biologically "mine"

 

[BoldonLad]

Ah, but you fail to highlight that the local bobby is the head of the triumvirate of parent/ educator and enforcer... the ultimate joint arbiters of what is stepping over the line... the one the parents use as a bogeyman to scare the bejesus out of their children... it was joined up society at work and it would be so easy to recreate the same... that's where adequate funding of the police comes in... every neighbourhood should have it's own bobby or two working with their communities, setting a moral and ethical standard of behaviour.

That was easy...

It gets better, that will bring the roof down

Still agree with, by the way.

 

[Archie_tect]

So, we're agreed it is a funding problem... and thereby a Government policy failure, not just for this Parliament but many, many others.

You should be comfortable openly agreeing with that as you didn't vote for them.

[Though Johnson isn't a good example if we are striving to set good parenting role models... just for a bit of balance].

 

[newfhouse]

All your faults are so faithfully reproduced.

You are Philip Larkin AICMFP.

 

[LCpl Boiled Egg]

Look out folks..

There's an expert, with an opinion on the loose..

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2021/nov/19/do-long-jail-sentences-stop-we-ask-the-expert

Didn't Cokey Gove say we'd had enough of experts?

 

[mudsticks]

That is the moral dilemma... soft cop/ hard cop... every child needs achievable and clear boundaries. Parenting is hard work, young children don't have the skills to set what's right or wrong- that's where parents and their immediate neighbours and communities need to establish rules which everyone sticks to and enforces consistently and fairly.

So, we're agreed it is a funding problem... and thereby a Government policy failure, not just for this Parliament but many, many others.

You should be comfortable openly agreeing with that as you didn't vote for them.

[Though Johnson isn't a good example if we are striving to set good parenting role models... just for a bit of balance].

This is becoming a little bit 'youth of today' presupposing that the kids aren't alright.

I know you'll say something along the lines of 'self selecting bias'

But the vast, majority of kids I come across are very switched on , articulate, and with a far greater understanding of how relationships work, than my generation did. .

And no they're not all 'middle class' little darlings..

Yes parenting is hard, best done by a community, not just biological 'parents'.

I think parenting needs to be discussed more openly at school .

There certainly needs to be far more, community provision and space made for youth .

For them to let off steam, through sport or other activities, in order to express their creativity, to have a chance to contribute to their community, and to access help if they need it.

I saw so much purposeful youthful activity and energy going on at the COP.

Astonishing, brilliant, inspirational.

A lot of the youthful energy , and exuberance just needs channeling..

Not surpressing, and admonishing, by grumpy old f*RTS .

 

[mudsticks]

All your faults are so faithfully reproduced.

And even some of ones awesome talents too .

Thankfully

 

[Bromptonaut]

They also got off to a bad start with the tale of someone falling seriously ill in the back of an ambulance in one of their jams, and someone else being injured in a pile up caused by the protest.

The first of those is a legitimate complaint.

The second is just bad driving. A traffic queue doesn't drop from the sky; it develops over a period of time. If you'repaying attention and scanning well ahead, as far as you can see, you'll spot the brake lights etc.

Too many 'drive' focussed only on what's directly in front.

 

[Archie_tect]

This is becoming a little bit 'youth of today' presupposing that the kids aren't alright.

I know you'll say something along the lines of 'self selecting bias'

But the vast, majority of kids I come across are very switched on , articulate, and with a far greater understanding of how relationships work, than my generation did. .

And no they're not all 'middle class' little darlings..

Yes parenting is hard, best done by a community, not just biological 'parents'.

I think parenting needs to be discussed more openly at school .

There certainly needs to be far more, community provision and space made for youth .

For them to let off steam, through sport or other activities, in order to express their creativity, to have a chance to contribute to their community, and to access help if they need it.

I saw so much purposeful youthful activity and energy going on at the COP.

Astonishing, brilliant, inspirational.

A lot of the youthful energy , and exuberance just needs channeling..

Not surpressing, and admonishing, by grumpy old f*RTS .

Good parenting isn't guaranteed, and it isn't class-driven... I was responding to the BL's persistence to identify what is meant by societal ills to identify where kids who are about to or have fallen off the rails can be nurtured and have boundaries they are comfortable in... that's when communities and neighbourhood policing can help to protect the vulnerable by introducing the failsafes and boundaries that children deserve... and that needs funds to support the work being done, often by volunteers, especially in inner cities and/or abandoned to sink estates. Thank goodness for the shining lights which strive to help in the face of poverty and depravation.

 

[mudsticks]

Good parenting isn't guaranteed, and it isn't class-driven... I was responding to the BL's persistence to get identify what is meant by societal ills to identify where kids who are about to or have fallen off the rails can be nurtured and have boundaries they are comfortable in... that's when communities and neighbourhood policing can help to protect the vulnerable by introducing the failsafes and boundaries that children deserve... and that needs funds to support the work being done, often by volunteers, especially in inner cities and/or abandoned to sink estates. Thank goodness for the shining lights which strive to help in the face of poverty and depravation.

I agree, thank goodness for those people who do so much in their communities, for so little return. Proper heroes.

Often they'll even get sneered at as 'do gooders' or 'interfering busybodies' or somesuch

But it shouldn't fall to luck that those people are there.
There needs to be grown up, joined up provision of properly funded services.

Luck and charity aren't good government.

Can you get on with forming that green social justice party please, so we can all vote for it..??

There's a good chap now 💚💜🌱🌻💃