Badenoch's (Lack Of) Vision Quest

[briantrumpet]

If I was a property developer I'd be looking at all those Conservative Clubs as being ripe for redevelopment.

I wonder if they'll just end up dissociating themselves from the Tory Party and becoming social clubs if the Tory Party continues its implosion.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Association_of_Conservative_Clubs

 

[BoldonLad]

So who are all these 'middle ground' voters voting for? The Conservatives were never going to anything but badly here given the nature of the constituency.
Certainly not the Lib Dems who did even worse then them.
They don't seem keen on voting Labour either given the collapse in the Labour vote.
The only winners last night were the Greens and Reform. For the 3 traditional parties it was a disaster.

Quite. The Greens and Reform are no doubt picking the former Conservative Voters, but, the increase in support of Greens and Reform exceeds the former Conservative vote share.

The same appears to be happening in the Constituency in which I live, although, we only have Local Elections to gauge actual votes by (rather that doubtful opinion polls).

In the former Labour heartlands, the Conservative has not collapsed, it never existed. The short lived breaching of the Red Wall, by Boris, was Labour Voters voting against Labour, not for Tories.

 

[BoldonLad]

If I was a property developer I'd be looking at all those Conservative Clubs as being ripe for redevelopment.

Surprisingly, there is a thriving Conservative Club near where I live.

It is possible that the entire Conservative Voting population, of South Tyneside, drink there, but, I rather suspect that it's clientele are not all Conservatives. I also suspect it's popularity is inexpensive drinks, clean comfortable seats, and, good snooker and pool tables.

 

[briantrumpet]

Surprisingly, there is a thriving Conservative Club near where I live.

It is possible that the entire Conservative Voting population drink there, but, I rather suspect that it's clientele are not all Conservatives. I also suspect it's popularity is inexpensive drinks, clean comfortable seats, and, good snooker and pool tables.

I think they are a relic of a time when the major political parties were in effect dating clubs as much as anything, where you could meet like-minded potential spouses.

 

[BoldonLad]

I think they are a relic of a time when the major political parties were in effect dating clubs as much as anything, where you could meet like-minded potential spouses.

don't tell Mrs @BoldonLad that, she will stop my pocket money 😊

In this area, it was Catholic Clubs, Catholic Youth Clubs, and Ceili which fulfilled that role 😊 us Protestants had to lie about our alliegences and drink Guinness to get any action. 😊

 

[Beebo]

and Lib Dems... well, who knows?

You would think the press might give air time to a party with 70 seats.
But they focus on Reform.
The centre ground is boring.

 

[briantrumpet]

You would think the press might give air time to a party with 70 seats.
But they focus on Reform.
The centre ground is boring.

That's very true, but I'm getting less and less convinced by Ed Davey even so.

 

[Pross]

You would think the press might give air time to a party with 70 seats.
But they focus on Reform.
The centre ground is boring.

I can't work out if it is something the Party are doing or not doing or maybe it's simply that being sensible and middle of the road doesn't create enough sales and clickbait so the media ignore them. It's a bit of a scandal really.

 

[Pross]

So who are all these 'middle ground' voters voting for? The Conservatives were never going to anything but badly here given the nature of the constituency.
Certainly not the Lib Dems who did even worse then them.
They don't seem keen on voting Labour either given the collapse in the Labour vote.
The only winners last night were the Greens and Reform. For the 3 traditional parties it was a disaster.

I would say middle-ground voters are being forced to vote tactically. It's probably why the Greens got in yesterday, I doubt there are that many who genuinely support the Greens but unless you are a Reform voter you are probably looking at the best option to keep them out.

I'll probaby be doing the same in the Senedd elections, my area has been solidly Labour in the past allowing me to vote for my preferred candidate safe in the knowledge they won't get in but if the opinion polls look like Reform are in the running I'll be going for the best option to keep them out (probably Plaid if Labour get the same level of kicking here, not sure what level of support the Greens can attract). It's a very negative and depressing way to do politics but when the main Parties appear to have lost the plot due to getting panicked by Farage I don't know what the option is. I certainly don't want to live in a country run by Reform but I'm increasingly concerned it will happen.

 

[briantrumpet]

I would say middle-ground voters are being forced to vote tactically. It's probably why the Greens got in yesterday, I doubt there are that many who genuinely support the Greens but unless you are a Reform voter you are probably looking at the best option to keep them out.

I'll probaby be doing the same in the Senedd elections, my area has been solidly Labour in the past allowing me to vote for my preferred candidate safe in the knowledge they won't get in but if the opinion polls look like Reform are in the running I'll be going for the best option to keep them out (probably Plaid if Labour get the same level of kicking here, not sure what level of support the Greens can attract). It's a very negative and depressing way to do politics but when the main Parties appear to have lost the plot due to getting panicked by Farage I don't know what the option is. I certainly don't want to live in a country run by Reform but I'm increasingly concerned it will happen.

I think you must be my long-lost Welsh twin, as your voting history that you've mentioned in the past and your reasoning for who you'd vote for now (and why) pretty much exactly mirror mine.

 

[Pross]

I think you must be my long-lost Welsh twin, as your voting history that you've mentioned in the past and your reasoning for who you'd vote for now (and why) pretty much exactly mirror mine.

Yeah, an early 90s Major led Tory Party would definitely get my vote again. I'd also potentially vote for 1997 Blair although I didn't at the time. It feels like proper politics has just disappeared.

 

[Rusty Nails]

A few of the political clubs have gone round here, as have the ex servicemen's type clubs. Too expensive to run and people don't want to sit in some scruffy old bar chatting politics anymore.

Have you been in a “political” club recently. I have been to both Labour and Con clubs recently and, while they are definitely on the tired and scruffy side there is no more talk about politics than in any public or club.

 

[bobzmyunkle]

Yeah, an early 90s Major led Tory Party would definitely get my vote again. I'd also potentially vote for 1997 Blair although I didn't at the time. It feels like proper politics has just disappeared.

Major, sort of like Thatcherism but less strident. Blair, sort of like Thatcher but with Sure Start etc. These are the governments that got us to where we are today, where large proportions of the electorate are p*used off and prepared to believe the garbage that Farage spouts.
Let's go back to that time where we were doing well at the proles expense and before the proles got uppity? Why would it work second time round?

 

[AuroraSaab]

Have you been in a “political” club recently. I have been to both Labour and Con clubs recently and, while they are definitely on the tired and scruffy side there is no more talk about politics than in any public or club.

Not for a couple of years. The drinks are cheap I'll give them that. I think our local ones have also suffered from the move towards fancy party venues. People used to have weddings/anniversary parties and 21sts in our local ones but small local venues are out of favour for those things now.

 

[Ian H]

Have you been in a “political” club recently. I have been to both Labour and Con clubs recently and, while they are definitely on the tired and scruffy side there is no more talk about politics than in any public or club.

A Tory councillor (a friend of mine despite our very different political views) was at pains to point out that the Con Club here* is a separate organisation, not funded by the Tories. In fact, it appears to function more as a slightly seedy pub.

*and possibly across the country.