BRFR Cake Stop 'breaking news' miscellany

[Beebo]

I also spend quite a bit of time in places where fire has caused considerable damage.

NYE celebrations are notorious for being over capacity. Im sure we’ve all spent our youth in places which were far too busy and almost impossible to escape from quickly if the worst had happened.

Nothing on a ceiling should be instantly flammable, but it’s easy to see how staff could have put up Christmas decorations without thinking. I bet you could go into almost any pub in UK and find some paper decorations that shouldn’t be there. The concern is how a fire spreads from decorations into an inferno so fast.

I once went to a residential house where the owner had had a NYE party with real candles in a Christmas tree that was tinder dry. The tree went up almost instantly causing extensive damage. A couple of month old trees in a basement would be devastating.

Sad news coming out is that some victims were very young 15 which is under the legal Swiss age. So could be looking at under age drinking too.

 

[briantrumpet]

Sad news coming out is that some victims were very young 15 which is under the legal Swiss age. So could be looking at under age drinking too.

I'd not be surprised if jail time is one of the results. I can't imagine the Swiss authorities being lenient in the circumstances.

 

[Beebo]

FTSE breaks through 10,000points for first time. Up 20% in a year.
Is there a crash just around the corner?

 

[First Aspect]

FTSE breaks through 10,000points for first time. Up 20% in a year.
Is there a crash just around the corner?

Yes.

 

[briantrumpet]

Yes.

 

[Pblakeney]

View attachment 11909

Yes.

 

[Beebo]

Photo of the nightclub just as the fire started doesn’t show any Christmas decorations but does show some sort of textured insulation presumably as sound proofing and added post construction.
The flammable materials coupled with indoor fireworks would be a big fire safety failure.

 

[First Aspect]

That is sound proofing foam.

Even if it is soaked in a retardant, it would eventually burn, but it's not necessarily the case that it would be the main vector. I don't suppose one can tell from that photo whether it's ignited from above or below. There are clearly electrical cables running to that thing on the ceiling, for example.

Best leave figuring this sort of thing out to the experts.

 

[matticus]

Lordy.

Those of us that have been on fire training courses have probably seen many of the same horrific videos, of crowds dying in - or trying to escape from - small spaces; they usually start looking very much like that still

 

[presta]

It'll be interesting to see if they contravened existing regulations - in which case I'd expect there to be a prosecution - or whether the regulations are insufficient.

I've no idea what's allowed here in the UK, but I don't think unnecessary naked flames in crowded public buildings should be one of them. There used to be a wine bar in Chelmsford that had candles on all the tables, and worse still, they were using wine bottles as candlesticks. You couldn't think of a more unstable, top-heavy arrangement. Nevertheless, the incident I saw wasn't caused by one falling over, it was when a girl leaned forward to talk to someone at the far end of the table, and set her hair on fire. Fortunately someone smothered it with their hand within seconds, and no harm was done, but it shows just how quickly things can go badly wrong, particularly if they off guard and having fun.

 

[presta]

Looking the videos of people just stood watching the ceiling burn reminds me of this:

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RVyQo4zkiDs

 

[icowden]

Looking the videos of people just stood watching the ceiling burn reminds me of this:

This is where someone who is neurodiverse is useful. I'd have been in there telling them they were bloody idiots and to evacuate.
And yes, if they didn't move sharpish I'd have left them to fry if necessary.

 

[Beebo]

The place seems quite small, but so far we know of 40 dead and 119 injured. So a total of 159 people not including those who escaped unharmed.
It must have been absolutely packed with nowhere to move. Once the stairs get blocked with panicked people you have no chance.
It’s the stuff of nightmares.

 

[briantrumpet]

The place seems quite small, but so far we know of 40 dead and 119 injured. So a total of 159 people not including those who escaped unharmed.
It must have been absolutely packed with nowhere to move. Once the stairs get blocked with panicked people you have no chance.
It’s the stuff of nightmares.

In England the fire safety assessments calculate how long it would take to evacuate a building via available exits and strictly limit numbers based on that (I can't remember how that element went so wrong with Grenfell, and it's a scandal no-one's been had up for that alone). I would be surprised if Switzerland doesn't have a similar system, but it will be interesting to see what the authorities announce, and whether it's a regulatory fail, a lack of implementation, or both.

 

[Beebo]

(I can't remember how that element went so wrong with Grenfell, and it's a scandal no-one's been had up for that alone).

Grenfell had a “shelter in place” instruction for fires. It only had a single internal stairwell which was too dangerous for mass evacuation.
Each flat is classed an individual concrete compartment so the theory is that with adequate fire stopping any fire and smoke couldn’t spread between the flats.
Except as we all now know it spread up the outside of the building due to numerous mistakes with retro fitting the flammable cladding. (It’s a circular firing squad with everyone blaming everyone else)
In principle it was a safe structure before the cladding was installed. The fire would have been fairly easily contained and the occupant of the affected flat got out very easily.