Cut parents benefits over school truancy

[Deleted member 121]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-64803947

So, the suggestion is by Disco Gove that for kids that don't persistently go to school, child benefit would be cut (more likely stopped) until the child goes back to school in good order. Lets assume that is on top of fines that Councils can currently impose.

Child Benefit is an interesting benefit to cut as it is claimable by all parents irrespective of their situation and income, assuming one of them doesn't earn over £50,000. So, what about truant little rich kids?

It's a complex issue, Teenage children can be unreasonable and difficult, i know first hand. There can be an element of bad parenting for those that may nonchalantly allow their children time off and perhaps this is aimed at them which i doubt but working parents with difficult children could face what is not a small penalty when factoring in fines and a reduction or a complete stop in Child Benefit amounting to hundreds of pounds a month. This is likely to further exasperate issues relating to rebellious teens who are unlikely to give a fudge about the financial plight being placed on parents and the days of physical control of children has long since expired both in law and what is deemed socially acceptable.

It seems to me that Disco Gove is suggesting a method of dealing with Truancy about 100 years too late...

What is needed is support, surely and not more hammering of low and middle income households which is disproportionate to the "crime" being committed...

 

[BoldonLad]

Just more 'noise' which will never be implemented

 

[icowden]

What is needed is support, surely and not more hammering of low and middle income households which is disproportionate to the "crime" being committed...

Totally agree. Where kids are truanting the issue is almost always with the parents / lack of parenting and likely to be linked with abuse at home. Cutting benefit is not going to help the situation. Intervention and support is what is needed. Fund the schools properly so that they can afford full time SENDCos, rebuild the Educational Psychology service so that support gets put in place more quickly and watch the "truanting" go down.

Maybe he thinks truanting is still like Billy Bunter.

 

[AuroraSaab]

Once most kids get to Year 9, especially boys, it is virtually impossible for parents to get a school refuser into school under duress. They can be persuaded and cajoled into attending but physically forcing them into school doesn't work and the threat of removing child benefit won't work either. This scheme would cost a fortune to administer and wouldn't improve attendance much. It would really just be another fine.

Put the money into initiatives like Sure Start and free child care. Any interventions made early on with disadvantaged kids will bring far more benefits (for all of us in society) than trying to address the issues at the high school stage.

 

[Electric_Andy]

Once most kids get to Year 9, especially boys, it is virtually impossible for parents to get a school refuser into school under duress. They can be persuaded and cajoled into attending but physically forcing them into school doesn't work and the threat of removing child benefit won't work either. This scheme would cost a fortune to administer and wouldn't improve attendance much. It would really just be another fine.

Put the money into initiatives like Sure Start and free child care. Any interventions made early on with disadvantaged kids will bring far more benefits (for all of us in society) than trying to address the issues at the high school stage.

+1 to that. My partner's son has unresolved mental health problems and hardly went to school at all in year 10, he's currently missed most of his mock GCSEs now in year 11 (he's done about 5 days so far since september). My partner is constantly worried as, being self-employed, can't often do the hours she needs to get by, due to spending an hour calming him down in the morning or clearing up after he's trashed his room, or occasionally coordinating poilce and SS if he's run away. The times he has been in school, he has run away or gone to the "chill out area" and run, or thrown chairs at walls. So she's skint, and can't physically get her 6 foot son to school. How is fining going to help anything? The most help she can get after years of begging is a social services guy who comes around for 1 hour per week. The only counselling offered is by the school which, guess what, he has to go to school to receive. That is the problem. Gove, like most other Tories, could not come up with a solution to a problem if it smacked him in the face

 

[C R]

Once most kids get to Year 9, especially boys, it is virtually impossible for parents to get a school refuser into school under duress. They can be persuaded and cajoled into attending but physically forcing them into school doesn't work and the threat of removing child benefit won't work either. This scheme would cost a fortune to administer and wouldn't improve attendance much. It would really just be another fine.

Put the money into initiatives like Sure Start and free child care. Any interventions made early on with disadvantaged kids will bring far more benefits (for all of us in society) than trying to address the issues at the high school stage.

What are you, some kind bleeding heart pinko liberal?

I suspect Gove knows perfectly well that what he is proposing is a non starter, but I also suspect that you and I are not the audience he is talking to.

 

[ebikeerwidnes]

Funnily enough I search for this to get some details
because I only heard about the 'cutting benefits' bit - and not that it was Child Benefit

Came up with an article from 6 Oct 2015 about pretty much the same announcement by David Cameron

Still - very Green and environmentally friendly policy - recycling and all that!!


But - back to the point

Tory concept - fine/punish/dogwhistle

No concept of help and investigation and reasons

not a whole lot of moral high ground for forcing parents, who are/maybe struggling to pay their bills, to drag their kid to school if the reason they are not going is genuine - such as bullying or stress and all that

OK there are some parents who would prefer to go shopping with their kid or couldn;t be bothered to actually 'parent' them - but the people for whom a fine - which can alreday be imposed - will make a difference and all the poorer in society.
Rich people are either not getting CHild Benefit - or can manage without it

ANd also - certainly with some kids I taught - any such measure could generate a situation at home where borderline child abuse becomes genuine child abuse where the parents decide enough is enough and take action in the wrong way

which is not what we need


not very well thought out from an education policy point of view
well thought out from a "dog whistle to the loyal base" point of view

 

[AuroraSaab]

It's based on the premise that the parents of school refusers are lazy and feckless and the kids aren't in school because the adults can't be bothered to make them go. There are certainly a few like that but it's not the majority, not at secondary level anyway. And those parents aren't the ones who will be brought into line by the loss of child benefit. It will simply mostly punish the desperate parents who cooperate with the school, take time off work for meetings, bring their kids to the door every day, but still can't get them to have regular and consistent attendance.

I'd also add that some teenagers can be threatening, aggressive, and violent towards their family. Their parents can't even keep them in the house at night so the idea that these kids will go to school to get their mum £14 a week is nonsense.

 

[Beebo]

the Tory government took away my universal child support payments in 2011 when it became means tested. I’m owed well over £10,000 in back payments.
My children have never missed any days due to truancy. So can I have my £10,000 back please?

 

[Electric_Andy]

Also forgot to say, the school had a meeting regards non attendance about a year ago, some other bod was there (educational welfare officer?) Who told my partner not to worry about being fined because it's not enforceable. I'd like to think they only fine on a case by case basis, I guess this ties in with the fines for taking kids out of school to go on holiday? So it does sound at the moment that they do consider extenuating circumstances i.e certain conditions and mental health

 

[AuroraSaab]

They usually do consider if you are making the effort to get your kids in school. Schools don't want to alienate decent parents.

I think some of this thinking is linked to the idea that fining parents for taking holidays in term time worked so why wouldn't cutting child benefit, when the 2 things are very different. One's a deterrent to make parents think twice, the other is a punishment for (mostly) already desperate parents.

 

[Deleted member 28]

the Tory government took away my universal child support payments in 2011 when it became means tested. I’m owed well over £10,000 in back payments.
My children have never missed any days due to truancy. So can I have my £10,000 back please?

Poor you, I would imagine with at least one of you earning £50k you genuinely don't feel hard done by?

 

[Milzy]

More idiotic nonsense. The NHS 0-19 service could really help with this problem, they’re spread so thinly a lot of issues don’t get picked up in time.

 

[Beebo]

Poor you, I would imagine with at least one of you earning £50k you genuinely don't feel hard done by?

No.
But the point is the government need to add some carrot instead of always using the stick.

 

[Deleted member 28]

No.
But the point is the government need to add some carrot instead of always using the stick.

What, pay people to have kids?