Gender again. Sorry!

[monkers]

Apart from the fact that what you describe is racism

Exactly (though strictly speaking it's xenophobia) and had I meant it then it would be disgusting. Almost as disgusting as your comments about trans women which are transphobic. Stereotyping a group of people to demonise them is wrong, and needs to end as a practice.

Which is why you should fark off until you wake up to the fact that you are a gullible dupe and useful idiot to the petit fascists that abound on social media.

Amended following my reading of ICowden's post.

 

[monkers]

The actual point is that we don't give men access to women's spaces and services based on the level of their erectile dysfunction, however much you write about it. Because that would be ridiculous.

In USA Cycling events nothing is required other than self ID as a woman, which is why there are so many men in women's cycling events over there. Fortunately UCI have altered the rules since Tokyo and these men won't be eligible for the Paris Olympics.

Atrophy via hormonal change is not erectile dysfunction you moron.

 

[AuroraSaab]

Atrophy via hormonal change is not erectile dysfunction you moron.

It's the same effect and you've used that fact as an argument that therefore such men who do self-induce erectile dysfunction with hormones couldn't possibly be a danger to women because 'flacid little chappy'. Which we all know is bs.

So let's put this out there straight out, a trans woman on hormones loses the capacity to be a rapist, though technically they could fit under the definition if they were to force another person to take the flacid little chappy into their mouth.

 

[monkers]

I think @monkers has previously argued this point quite eloquently which is that generally they do because that which applies to men in terms of illegal or obnoxious behaviour also applies to women.

Thank you for this. In the past I tried reasonable argument. However reading more than 15 000 posts, many written by those who are either not interested in facts, the lived experiences of trans women, instead revelling in the bigotry of the chief protagonists on here, I am reduced to telling the moron who keeps tagging me with his lies to ''just fark off''.

The floppy penis lie told by Aurora and believed by her useful idiot refers to comments made in #1000.

The bigots love to tell of the numbers of trans women who retain a penis. Here is the truth behind the situation under the current regime in the UK.

A person begins transition with the aim of obtaining a GRC. The process typically starts with the person complaining to their GP of gender incongruence. The GP refers the person to a psychiatrist to assess if transition is appropriate to that person. This is often seen as a 'gatekeeping process', though to be fair, a process that looks to identity comorbid psychiatric conditions is in my opinion at least a reasonable starting point.

The GP then has to apply to the relevant local health trust for funding for the transition process. Once funding is secured, the GP makes a referral to the gender identity clinic. The waiting list for these clinics is currently reported to be in the order of 5 to 7 years for a first appointment In the meantime the person is left unsupported.

After the first appointment, it is possible that the person may go on to prescribed hormone therapy after a further wait of about 6 months.

Atrophy of the penis, testicles, and scrotum begins with about a month. After three months it is significant. The timing of surgery is critical. One of the most important issues is dependent on donor material for surgery. If the wait between the prescription of hormones and the opportunity for surgery is left too long, then the extent of the atrophy may mean that insufficient donor material for surgery remains.

The long delays has led to transitioners remaining on hormones for years with surgery being delayed again and again. These people then become unsuitable for penile inversion surgery. So you should be able to understand that many of those trans women who retain a penis, do so involuntarily.

Frankly the view from some that transitioners retain the libido or the ability to rape are outlandishly ridiculous.

This is completely distinct from men who experience erectile disfunction which is often temporary or maybe remedied. ED does not lead to atrophy.

I dare say the idiotic Dutchman living in the UK will tag me in the next round of his purile comments. He needn't bother, my response will be the usual.

 

[monkers]

It's the same effect and you've used that fact as an argument that therefore such men who do self-induce erectile dysfunction with hormones couldn't possibly be a danger to women because 'flacid little chappy'. Which we all know is bs.

Taken as a whole post #1000 makes my point clearly.

Any further references are me taking the piss out of morons such as you. A penis with hormonal atrophy is not merely 'flacid'.

Trans women who have been on a hormone replacement regime for a few months have a drastic loss of libido. They have no will to sexually attack women, and even in the unlikely event that they retained such a drive, they know they would be incapable.

Add to this the data. Trans women are not implicated in sexual attacks. Stop invoking women into unnecessary moral panic with your lies.

 

[AuroraSaab]

A person begins transition with the aim of obtaining a GRC.

How can you possibly know this?

Very few GRC's are issued compared to the number of people who claim to be trans.
Eddie Izzard doesn't have one. India Willoughby said they wouldn't get one. So they aren't transwomen then? I don't recall Eddie Izzard saying they are even on hormones either.

Frankly the view from some that transitioners retain the libido or the ability to rape are outlandishly ridiculous.

This argument rests on the idea that only those men on hormones are transwomen. This has not been the position of any transactivist groups or of Stonewall, who have always held the view that self id'ing as a woman was enough - which in fact you've said several times. In order to have the protected quality of Gender Reassignment even the Equality Act says you don't have to be on hormones.

It also sets the bar at rape for what should make women uncomfortable about men in their spaces.

 

[AndyRM]

Izzard is genderfluid.

Which is a subtle, but important distinction.

 

[monkers]

Very few GRC's are issued compared to the number of people who claim to be trans.
Eddie Izzard doesn't have one. India Willoughby said they wouldn't get one. So they aren't transwomen then? I don't recall Eddie Izzard saying they are even on hormones either.

Listen up moron. Izzard does not seem to be undergoing transition, just living their best life - so not an example of the people I indicated.

Willoughby I don't know about, though I know of her.

There is no capacity in the system. So many people are just held up or give up. Others just do not agree with the system and refuse to undergo it.

These are some of the reasons that the all party select committee recommended to government that in order to get rid of the back log and the unnecessary stigma of a unnecessary and medicalised process that self-id was the way forward.

As you are so tedious, I guess I have to explain that I am not expressing my view of what the ideal system is, just explaining where the system is at and what has been proposed by others to change it.

Theresa May promised to change the system. Sadly the ultra Brexit twats in her party booted her out due to their zeal to damage the country, so change never happened.

 

[AuroraSaab]

Izzard is genderfluid.
Which is a subtle, but important distinction.

Eddie has said they're a woman and uses women's facilities, so to everybody else there's no distinction between Eddie and any other male sexed person who does the same. How Eddie views themself isn't the issue.

Listen up moron. Izzard does not seem to be undergoing transition, just living their best life - so not an example of the people I indicated.

See above. You seem to be telling Eddie he isn't a woman, despite him saying he is. Who are you to decide what constitutes transitioning?

 

[AndyRM]

Eddie has said they're a woman and uses women's facilities, so to everybody else there's no distinction between Eddie and any other male sexed person who does the same. How Eddie views themself isn't the issue.


See above. You seem to be telling Eddie he isn't a woman, despite him saying he is. Who are you to decide what constitutes transitioning?

Izzard has literally described themselves as genderfluid.

As I said, a subtle but important distinction.

 

[icowden]

Thank you for this. In the past I tried reasonable argument. However reading more than 15 000 posts, many written by those who are either not interested in facts, the lived experiences of trans women, instead revelling in the bigotry of the chief protagonists on here, I am reduced to telling the moron who keeps tagging me with his lies to ''just fark off''.

The floppy penis lie told by Aurora and believed by her useful idiot refers to comments made in #1000.

The bigots love to tell of the numbers of trans women who retain a penis. Here is the truth behind the situation under the current regime in the UK.

A person begins transition with the aim of obtaining a GRC. The process typically starts with the person complaining to their GP of gender incongruence. The GP refers the person to a psychiatrist to assess if transition is appropriate to that person. This is often seen as a 'gatekeeping process', though to be fair, a process that looks to identity comorbid psychiatric conditions is in my opinion at least a reasonable starting point.

I think I agree although we must also accept that not all trans people have the aim of obtaining a GRC and some do not begin transition as such. Izzard has already been mentioned.

And indeed whilst this refers specifically to the UK, it is far from clear whether the three transwomen shown in the recent cycling post have started any sort of transition. And this becomes one of the concerns - are they actually transwomen or men taking advantage of the lax rules to say that they are transwomen in order to win podium places.

 

[Deleted member 159]

Monkers picked up the baton of insulting in every post


View: https://x.com/AndrewGold_ok/status/1816850449871343785?t=YOf7qj4z2PsjInFrG_gQpQ&s=19

 

[monkers]

Eddie has said they're a woman and uses women's facilities, so to everybody else there's no distinction between Eddie and any other male sexed person who does the same. How Eddie views themself isn't the issue.

Try harder. That is still not in contention with what I had said. But there's no surprise that you just think being combative 'wins' the argument.

 

[monkers]

Monkers picked up the baton of insulting in every post


View: https://x.com/AndrewGold_ok/status/1816850449871343785?t=YOf7qj4z2PsjInFrG_gQpQ&s=19

Only the bigots and morons. You think that I should be reasonable with a nasty little troll like you? I don't think so.

 

[monkers]

See above. You seem to be telling Eddie he isn't a woman, despite him saying he is. Who are you to decide what constitutes transitioning?

Listen up again moron. I haven't said anything about Izzard except that they do not seem to be proposing transition. 'Transition' has a specific legal context; it isn't just any old thing you dream up inside that head of yours.