Gender again. Sorry!

[monkers]

Eddie Izzard doesn't have a GRC but uses women's spaces, ditto India Willoughby.



Who/what we call ourselves isn't a private matter once it starts to affect others.

You still think that human rights are a zero sum game in the case of cis women. This isn't the case. The entirety of this argument is bases on paranoia - you believe that trans women are out to get you. They are not. No trans person puts themselves through the rigours of transition in order to ''invade'' women's spaces. Do you think that trans women ''catch'' cancer in order to ''invade'' women's hospital wards? Yes, I've even seen gender critical people write this kind of nonsense, so I won't be so very surprised if you are one of those that think so.

I use women's spaces because for a long time now, I've been a woman, and never has one woman complained, or had cause for complaint. Do you think I can use men's spaces without being noticed?

 

[AuroraSaab]

Do you think you are using women's spaces without being noticed? You mistake women not saying anything for wholehearted consent.

Given that men don't have to go through surgery or take hormones to be considered transwomen, the argument that it involves some sacrifice on their part that means they should then be allowed access to female services isn't true. Again, you're someone who thinks women's spaces are a reward for these men.

Rights often do conflict. It's ridiculous to suggest they don't. Women lose out when men are in their single sex spaces.

 

[classic33]

Rights often do conflict. It's ridiculous to suggest they don't. Women lose out when men are in their single sex spaces.

Who loses out when women enter men's single sex spaces. Because contrary to your constant, unproven, narrative, it does happen.

 

[monkers]

Do you think you are using women's spaces without being noticed?

Yes.

 

[monkers]

Given that men don't have to go through surgery or take hormones to be considered transwomen,

This exception applies for those people where the options are not available for medical reasons. The panel expect to see hormones and/or surgery in place. Without their GP explaining why they are not, the panel generally will not approve.

The most usual reason that trans women can not have the surgery is due to the long delays in the NHS system - being on cross sex hormones for a long period of time causes such atrophy that there doesn't remain enough viable donor material.

The delays are the problem, something that the Select Committee and May government were aware of, and the reason they considered self-ID to be the only fair means of ameliorating that problem. Had it not been for the very Brexit problems, it may have happened.

 

[AuroraSaab]

Who loses out when women enter men's single sex spaces. Because contrary to your constant, unproven, narrative, it does happen.

Men. Men lose out. Pretty sure most men don't want women changing next to them, and don't want women present when they're in a men's rape support group. Men are allowed their own stuff too but because the risks are asymmetrical the discussion centres on men in women's spaces. Allowing women to join Men's Sheds groups is wrong in my opinion, but they're allowing that now apparently.

Yes.

That might be your perception. You can't possibly know that. Again, you think that because women don't challenge you they are consenting.

This exception applies for those people where the options are not available for medical reasons. The panel expect to see hormones and/or surgery in place. Without their GP explaining why they are not, the panel generally will not approve.

And.... we're back to True Trans. A complete turn around from your 'you are who you say you are' position.

 

[classic33]

Men. Men lose out. Pretty sure most men don't want women changing next to them, and don't want women present when they're in a men's rape support group. Men are allowed their own stuff too but because the risks are asymmetrical the discussion centres on men in women's spaces. Allowing women to join Men's Sheds groups is wrong in my opinion, but they're allowing that now apparently.

We're no longer "so flipping privileged in wanting stuff just for themselves." then?

 

[monkers]

Men. Men lose out. Pretty sure most men don't want women changing next to them, and don't want women present when they're in a men's rape support group. Men are allowed their own stuff too but because the risks are asymmetrical the discussion centres on men in women's spaces. Allowing women to join Men's Sheds groups is wrong in my opinion, but they're allowing that now apparently.



That might be your perception. You can't possibly know that. Again, you think that because women don't challenge you they are consenting.



And.... we're back to True Trans. A complete turn around from your 'you are who you say you are' position.

I don't recall my using that phrase. However, yes, I accept people for who they happen to be, it's basic respect.

 

[AuroraSaab]

We're no longer "so flipping privileged in wanting stuff just for themselves." then?

Is that supposed to be a quote from me? Unless you are talking about the past, when women were excluded from higher education, clubs, societies, and sports for no other reason than being women, then of course men are allowed their own spaces and their own stuff. Nobody has ever said otherwise.

 

[classic33]

Is that supposed to be a quote from me? Unless you are talking about the past, when women were excluded from higher education, clubs, societies, and sports for no other reason than being women, then of course men are allowed their own spaces and their own stuff. Nobody has ever said otherwise.

Nothing supposed about it.
You said it.

 

[AuroraSaab]

So I did. Here it is ... it's a very sarcastic response to a post that said that by wanting single sex spaces women were 'asking for extra rights'. They aren't. They're asking for safety, privacy, and dignity, in the very few circumstances where sex matters.

The fact that you can't recognise sarcasm is a you problem I'm afraid.

 

[CXRAndy]

View: https://x.com/jk_rowling/status/1953170294706680314?t=tI27EZOBtNfw5PzjCNmt8g&s=19