Gender again. Sorry!
- Thread starter theclaud
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AuroraSaab
Legendary Member
Dsd athletes who are biological males do pretty well considering they represent a tiny fraction of the population. That should tell you something about male advantage in female sports.
Transwomen also do quite a bit better in the women's category than they did in the male category when they do switch, eg Lia Thomas. That should also tell you something about male advantage.
The number setting World Records and winning Gold isn't relevant because we don't judge fairness in sports by results at the end. We judge it at the outset. A doping rider who comes last still has an unfair advantage.
Transwomen also do quite a bit better in the women's category than they did in the male category when they do switch, eg Lia Thomas. That should also tell you something about male advantage.
The number setting World Records and winning Gold isn't relevant because we don't judge fairness in sports by results at the end. We judge it at the outset. A doping rider who comes last still has an unfair advantage.
classic33
Senior Member
Odd that. Women's javelin "record" of 72.28.
Fatima Whitbread, MBE, threw 77.44 metres in Stuttgart, at the 1986 European Athletics Championships.
She was a British athlete that regularly threw further than some men taking part. So often, that other women were saying she wasn't a woman. But they were normally the ones that lost to her.
classic33
Senior Member
Surreal question...
classic33
Senior Member
Women's Marathon record held by Brigid Kosgei, a black athlete from Kenya. That means unfair advantage, so shouldn't count.
AuroraSaab
Legendary Member
You could have just googled why there was an anomaly. They changed the design of the javelin. Did the same in men's javelin.
Yes, athletically built women are often the target of abuse for defying conventional beauty standards. Men get similar abuse for failing to live up to society's imposed standard of stereotypical 'masculinity'. Fortunately we all know that being a man or a woman is nothing to do with how you look.
Yes, athletically built women are often the target of abuse for defying conventional beauty standards. Men get similar abuse for failing to live up to society's imposed standard of stereotypical 'masculinity'. Fortunately we all know that being a man or a woman is nothing to do with how you look.
multitool
Shaman
Exactly this.
icow appropriated Adele into his list of terfy women, so he must have assumed she was referring to the anti-trans crap. >
She wasn't.
But icow won't take Adele at her word, and is pretending that secretly she is a terf, but has been scared out of saying so. And this is the guy who talks about silencing women and misogyny.
classic33
Senior Member
She, Whitbread, had to undergo repeated tests just to keep those who said she shouldn't be competing in the women's events. The results of these tests were never made public after they were done, but she was allowed to continue taking part.
There's other anomalies in that list. You can search for them all, but a question for you.
Why isn't the slower current marathon record time on the list?
multitool
Shaman
Definitively coming for the gays now.
Next stop women.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...-pride-merchandise?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other
But still the useful idiots cannot see what is taking shape.
Next stop women.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...-pride-merchandise?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other
But still the useful idiots cannot see what is taking shape.
AuroraSaab
Legendary Member
Sex testing was routine in the 70's and 80's as far as I tell. I'm not sure Whitbread was singled out. I recall Sharon Davies talking about doing cheek swab tests when competing.
I don't know what you mean. The record listed for women is Brigid Kosgai's WR from 2019. Long distance events, including ultra distance running and cycling, are among the few events in which women can out perform men - overall conditioning and mental toughness coming in to play in a way that they don't in shorter distances.
Next stop women? American right wing groups have targeted gay rights and women's abortion rights for years. It's nothing new. They've just added more to the list. It's been a long term campaign of US Christian fundamentalists and the abortion laws were a target for decades.
This idea that if you don't stick up for gender ideology then they'll take women's rights is a nonsense protection racket espoused by people who have done nothing to secure those rights or extend them. I don't trust the Left with women's rights any more than I trust the Right.
And no, I don't support death threats to the designers of supermarket t shirts anymore than I would imagine you support death threats to J.K. Rowling. If people don't want to buy stuff they don't approve of - whether it's swimsuits or wizard books - they can just not buy it.
classic33
Senior Member
Like I said, the current, slower women's marathon record time isn't on the list.
Simple really.
OP
OP
theclaud
Reading around the chip
Hair-splitting award! The convo went like this:
TC: Ohio Republicans are pushing a bill that will require genital inspection of children suspected of being trans.
AS Oh it's fine. I'm sure they just want a doctor's note.
It was here (linked below) in the Braverman thread. And no, it isn't different. A sports teacher demanding a note to say that a doctor has inspected a child's genitals ('external and internal inspection' were in the earlier wording of the bill, as I said upthread) is just sexual assault with a middleman. The children in question will almost always be girls. 'Protecting women's sports' and mandating sexual assault of girls who want to participate are not compatible goals, Aurora. Seeing as Googling furiously is your thing, but you might want to look into the history of gender verification in sport - it's starkly sexist, wildly misogynistic, overtly patriarchal and astonishingly racist at almost every turn. But I'm sure this time it'll be different and hugely empowering...
Rusty Nails
Country Member
Where have you been since you started this thread a year ago.
Without hair splitting it would have been put out of its misery 200 pages ago.
AuroraSaab
Legendary Member
So I didn't say 'I sanction genital inspections on schoolkids' as you claimed. I said a note from the GP would probably suffice. The doctor would presumably have access to their medical records; no genital inspection required.
The children in question will be boys who identify as girls and whose inclusion in female sports would be unfair to girls.
A PE teacher demanding a note from a medical doctor is akin to sexual assault? Did you never get a note from your mum to say you were on your period and couldn't go swimming? Kids routinely provide notes from doctors to school for everything from needing the toilet a lot to not doing PE because of x, y, or z.
You seem pretty upset about the invasion of privacy and dignity for a boy who identifies as a girl and not at all bothered about the privacy and dignity, or fairness, of the girls who have to compete against, or share changing and showering facilities with them.
Yes, sex testing in sport has always been directed at women because, guess what, there is no advantage to a country to have its female athletes competing in the male class.
