Gender again. Sorry!

[monkers]

In personal interaction I would use their actual name. Otherwise 'they' and 'them'. If they asked me outright I'd say that we remain the sex we are born. I don't think you have the right to demand what pronouns people use for you, though obviously you can use preferred pronouns for them if you wish. It would be asking people to lie and tacitly endorse an ideology they don't subscribe to.

People on here have no issue using 'cis' about others even though some find it offensive. I don't think they should be compelled not to use it, even out of politeness.

So in one breath it's all about respect and dignity for women, and in the next breath it's all about the rights of women to disrespect others. Look I get it, you're just a bigot making the same bigoted arguments as other bigots.

These assumed rights to disrespect are framed as personal freedoms and freedom of speech - which to people who know and understand human rights is just bigoted bolleaux.

There is nothing offensive about 'cis' but some bigots like to pretend that there is.

 

[monkers]

A true bigot would not.

I'll guess that many or most people know about keyboard warrior syndrome - only bravely bigoted while using an anonymous profile on a so-called 'social' media platform.

 

[monkers]

Which is fair enough. But do you do it to their faces?

I may be wrong, but I would suspect that like most normal people you would try to make a transwoman or transman comfortable when chatting by trying to use whatever pronouns they ask you to use etc. A true bigot would not.

Yup behind one's back bigotry is what 'normal people' do; and those who don't must be, erm ... abnormal. Got it.

 

[icowden]

There is nothing offensive about 'cis' but some bigots like to pretend that there is.

And some people just find it a bit annoying and pointless. It's interesting that in a thread which has encompassed the concept of non-binary than you seem to be insistent that this discussion must be binary.

There isn't room in your world for people who think that we should look after each other and try and make life as comfortable as possible for people with gender incongruence but are also concerned about the eroding of women's rights and the imposition of a belief based system of achieving the unachievable "if you believe you are a woman you are a women". For many people that last idea is frankly nonsense.

It doesn't mean that if you want to live as a woman or a man that you shouldn't be helped or supported. It does mean that care should be taken around life changing surgical interventions etc.

This isn't a binary topic and just calling people names doesn't help progress the discussion.

 

[icowden]

Yup behind one's back bigotry is what 'normal people' do; and those who don't must be, erm ... abnormal. Got it.

Now you are just being daft.

 

[monkers]

And some people just find it a bit annoying and pointless. It's interesting that in a thread which has encompassed the concept of non-binary than you seem to be insistent that this discussion must be binary.

You what fruitloops? Saying 'cis' is no slur is not denying the existence of that group or any other. Bad night's sleep was it?

The other ridiculous claim going around is that TERF is derogatory. A TERF proudly invented the term; other TERFs started saying it and wearing badges to proudly self-id as TERFs. Then they decided it was derogatory when people identified them as TERFs. Then they said the 'trans taliban' made it up to dehumanise them, while also saying they are 'reclaiming it', thereby acknowledging that they had indeed first used it and identified with it.

 

[AuroraSaab]

So in one breath it's all about respect and dignity for women, and in the next breath it's all about the rights of women to disrespect others. Look I get it, you're just a bigot making the same bigoted arguments as other bigots.

It's not a right that people refer to you as a woman if you are a male. Can white people demand that someone refers to them as black?

These assumed rights to disrespect are framed as personal freedoms and freedom of speech - which to people who know and understand human rights is just bigoted bolleaux.

It's a human right to be referred to by your preferred pronouns? Rather than just a politeness that some people are happy to do?

There is nothing offensive about 'cis' but some bigots like to pretend that there is.

Oh the irony. Crying human rights for some but anyone asking the same is a bigot.

 

[monkers]

Now you are just being daft.

Maybe I was just imitating you for effect?

 

[icowden]

Maybe I was just imitating you for effect?

If you were, it didn't work.

 

[icowden]

You what fruitloops? Saying 'cis' is no slur is not denying the existence of that group or any other. Bad night's sleep was it?

You tell me. You are the one resorting to insults again and not reading what was written.

The other ridiculous claim going around is that TERF is derogatory. A TERF proudly invented the term; other TERFs started saying it and wearing badges to proudly self-id as TERFs. Then they decided it was derogatory when people identified them as TERFs. Then they said the 'trans taliban' made it up to dehumanise them, while also saying they are 'reclaiming it', thereby acknowledging that they had indeed first used it and identified with it.

I have it on good authority that there is a minority group who use the "N" word amongst themselves but get quite upset when white supremacists use it.

 

[monkers]

It's a human right to be referred to by your preferred pronouns? Rather than just a politeness that some people are happy to do?

I rather thought a chap like you would already know the answer to that.

Oh the irony. Crying human rights for some but anyone asking the same is a bigot.

Trans people are not campaigning for anybody to lose any of their human rights. The groups that you associate with organise politically to reduce or remove the rights of trans people that have been in place for twenty or more years.

Insisting that while you pee in the private space of cubicle while people you don't like happen to be washing their hands on the other side of the door is not a human right either - it's bigotry.

 

[monkers]

If you were, it didn't work.

At least on you. I'm disappointed because I had some respect for your views at one point, but lately I've seen you post some pretty transphobic stuff and now I see you standing up for bigotry under the guise of 'normal people'. That's a shame.

 

[AuroraSaab]

I rather thought a chap like you would already know the answer to that.

Lol. Do you seriously imagine that actual women are insulted when you call them men? I've been misgendered loads of time. I don't give a toss because my sense of self isn't based on self-identifying as female. I simply am one.

Trans people are not campaigning for anybody to lose any of their human rights. The groups that you associate with organise politically to reduce or remove the rights of trans people that have been in place for twenty or more years.

The ability to exclude men from female spaces and services has been a thing for a very long time. You seek to undermine this. That is a loss for women and girls.

Insisting that while you pee in the private space of cubicle while people you don't like happen to be washing their hands on the other side of the door is not a human right either - it's bigotry.

You know very well that toilets are the least of the issues. If there's no issue because a cubicle is a private space then transwomen can use the Men's. The cubicles are just as private in there.

 

[monkers]

You know very well that toilets are the least of the issues. If there's no issue because a cubicle is a private space then transwomen can use the Men's. The cubicles are just as private in there.

Yes any woman can use any toilet, same for any man. Cis or trans makes no difference. But it isn't me causing the drama is it?

 

[monkers]

Do you seriously imagine that actual women are insulted when you call them men?

I neither call women 'men', or call men 'women'. I don't even use the term 'guys'. I made a reply to you in order to highlight the silliness of doing so - not that I can expect that you'll ever change - the bigotry is just too ingrained.