Rusty Nails
Country Member
Good luck with that.
Gender again. Sorry!
- Thread starter theclaud
- Start date
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Good luck with that.
bobzmyunkle
Senior Member
They're the silent majority don't you know.
Perhaps if you published your email address on this thread they'd feel safe enough to contact you.
multitool
Pharaoh
Well, policing other people's use of social media makes a change from policing their genitalia, Bromp
Riiiigght. "Plenty of examples on social media". That'll be from the same people saying they've been abused by trans people in lavatories, won't it Aurora
icowden
Squire
So is your position genuinely that you don't think anyone has had any issues ever and it's all made up?Riiiigght. "Plenty of examples on social media". That'll be from the same people saying they've been abused by trans people in lavatories, won't it Aurora
Is it all actors?
multitool
Pharaoh
I'm pointing out that people making claims on social media is no necessarily reliable evidence.
icowden
Squire
Which is a fair point, and we often agree on the dubiety of many of the sources posted. I think where we differ is that I don't think that it necessarily means that there aren't some stories that have some truth in them.
multitool
Pharaoh
Possibly, but so far I've heard loads of moral-panic stories about what children are being taught, but very little in the way of anything to corroborate this.
Besides, let's get real here. Anyone met any teachers? They have to be the most staid, centrist, cautious people out there, surely?
Bromptonaut
Rohan Man
- Location
- Bugbrooke, Northants
Do you mean trans people being abused have made it up or people saying they've had scary experiences with 'men' in female facilities have made it up?
multitool
Pharaoh
Answering for icowden here, and he'll correct me if needed, but I think he is referring to the notion of parents complaining about the transgender content of sex Ed, and asking me if I think reports of it on social media are fake.
multitool
Pharaoh
Well, here's some polling on transgender sex Ed
https://x.com/YouGov/status/1791380835821592853
"Should schools teach about gender identity? The government says they shouldn’t, but 60-61% of people say sex education should teach that people can be transgender or non-binary (including 66-67% of parents)"
And for the hard of thinking (hi AS) 67% = the vast majority.
https://x.com/YouGov/status/1791380835821592853
"Should schools teach about gender identity? The government says they shouldn’t, but 60-61% of people say sex education should teach that people can be transgender or non-binary (including 66-67% of parents)"
And for the hard of thinking (hi AS) 67% = the vast majority.
monkers
Legendary Member
Waiting for CXRnumbskull to say ''but the silent majority don't agree'', and for Aurora to say ''but the reality is that we all know'' and something about ''magical thinking''.
AuroraSaab
Squire
The issue isn't that of teaching that people who consider themselves not to be their birth exist, but of teaching that the concept of gender identity is a fact not a belief. Same goes for the born in the wrong body, gender is innate, more than 2 sexes stuff.
'Staid, centrist.. teachers' aren't producing these materials and often aren't even delivering the courses. Schools have outsourced these courses to groups who have an interest in promoting a certain view rather than fact based education.
Still, as you kept telling us, it's not even happening so there's nothing to worry about.
These companies can be quite lucrative businesses. They aren't charities. If schools and councils are paying hundreds if not thousands of pounds for these companies and their materials to be in schools there should be competent oversight of the content of the courses. Just as with other subjects the materials should be available to view.
'Staid, centrist.. teachers' aren't producing these materials and often aren't even delivering the courses. Schools have outsourced these courses to groups who have an interest in promoting a certain view rather than fact based education.
Still, as you kept telling us, it's not even happening so there's nothing to worry about.
These companies can be quite lucrative businesses. They aren't charities. If schools and councils are paying hundreds if not thousands of pounds for these companies and their materials to be in schools there should be competent oversight of the content of the courses. Just as with other subjects the materials should be available to view.
icowden
Squire
Actually I was just asking about the broader notion that any GC content on twitter is accused of being faked, when there must surely be some nuggets of truth in there.
TBH on the PHSE / Sex Ed front, I think it's usually best left to schools. Certainly I wouldn't recommend listening to Gillian Keegan about anything.
monkers
Legendary Member
I thought you were very keen on the concept of protected beliefs. On the one hand you claim that gender criticism is a protected belief therefore viable. If, as you will always say, gender identity is also a belief, how come it is not a protected belief and not viable? Hint: gender identity is formally and specifically recognised in law, hence Gender Recognition Act. There is no such status for anti-gender recognition.
Perhaps 'magical thinking' helps to overcome such difficulties?
AuroraSaab
Squire
It's not being taught as a belief or opinion in some schools though. The objection is to it being taught as fact by outsourced providers and in the materials schools buy.
I've never said belief in the existence of gender identity shouldn't be allowed. The law should rightly acknowledge people's right to believe in the earth being flat or religious souls too. I just don't think they should teach it to kids as a fact not an opinion.
It requires no magical thinking to think that people are free to believe what they wish, even if that belief is that they are no longer their birth sex. The magical thinking is required in accepting it as a fact.
I've never said belief in the existence of gender identity shouldn't be allowed. The law should rightly acknowledge people's right to believe in the earth being flat or religious souls too. I just don't think they should teach it to kids as a fact not an opinion.
It requires no magical thinking to think that people are free to believe what they wish, even if that belief is that they are no longer their birth sex. The magical thinking is required in accepting it as a fact.
