Gender again. Sorry!

[classic33]

Yes, it's not clear whether male body advantage exists. Nobody really knows why men perform better in most sports. It's a mystery frankly.

View attachment 8687

Explain Beryl Burton records, without using the word outlier(s) or anything similar.

 

[AuroraSaab]

Some exceptional women will beat men, even very good ones. This isn't news.

Exceptional as she was, wasn't the male record that Beryl beat a long distance one? A 12 hour time trial in which she rode 270 miles. It's well known that ultra events whether running, walking, or cycling, often reduce the performance gap between male and female because overall conditioning and mental toughness come into play rather than just pure strength, speed, power. Her record lasted 2 years.

If she wasn't an outlier lots of other female cyclists would still be breaking male records surely.

 

[classic33]

Maybe she was just an exceptional woman. With some of her womens records remaining unbroken for fifty years. This despite the advances made in bicycles in those same fifty years. Lighter, better gearing to name just two. And done at a time when women in cycling were under represented.

 

[classic33]

So much for women not being responsible for violent attacks.

A 22-year-old nursery worker has been convicted of abusing 21 babies, including kicking one little boy in the face and stepping on his shoulder.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/clylww5ykkvo

 

[AuroraSaab]

Nobody has ever said women don't commit violent offences. They do not commit violent or sexual offences at anything near the same rate as men though.

In the last week or so:

Man charged with sexual assault and murder of child he was adopting.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c6262ykz18xo.amp

Search for 'rape' in local newspapers. This is the last 10 days or so. Just rapes not other sexual assaults or indecent exposure, child abuse images etc.

Birmingham: male paedophile jailed, male rapist jailed, male paedophile spared jail, man found guilty of raping teenager.

https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/search/?q=Rape+charge

Manchester: 6 stories about grooming gangs, 2 men rape a woman in a park, man jailed for sex attacked he filmed, male paedophile deported.

https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/search/?q=Rape

London: attempted rape in a cinema, 3 male rowers accused of rape, man charged with rape after dna found, British soldier arrested for rape in Kenya.

https://www.standard.co.uk/

That's just 3 cities, one specific crime, in the last 10 days. So your continual claim that women are as bad as men doesn't really add up.

 

[Ian H]

The CNN one? I read it. It's a nothing burger of unevidenced trans activism.

It starts with the 'there aren't many men in women's sports so it's not a problem' claim and moves on to what is usually called the Phelps gambit - the idea that certain individuals have bodies that give them natural 'unfair' advantages in their sport - and therefore trans identifying men with their natural physical advantages (ie being male) should be allowed to compete with females. (This is York's 'people come in all sizes' claim).

This ignores the fact that the difference between elite males performance is often a fraction of a second. The difference between elite male and elite female performance is far larger.

It then goes on to quote a few studies that actually show that trans identifying men still have better performance after 4 years on hormones. In one case it was 12%, which is a huge advantage in sporting performance where milliseconds separate athletes.

It finishes with 'What really is the importance of sport?', putting it out there that inclusion is more important than fairness. In which case you should allow doping and heavyweights to box featherweights really.

It's literally assessing what evidence actually exists.
And 'what is sport for' is a decades-old general question most often directed at sports education.

But you carry on.

 

[AuroraSaab]

It doesn't assess the evidence. It cherry picks a couple of studies with confounding factors - which aren't of athletes - that suggest cross sex hormones reduce performance in trans identifying men after the 2 to 4 year stage. That's literally the best evidence they can come up with.

It omits to mention the scores of studies that show that males perform better than women in most sports and that current testosterone levels are not the main factor in males vs female athletic attainment.

You can carry on trying to get men in women's sports if you like. It's an ideological position though and you could at least admit that rather than pretending you have no idea why thousands of men and high school boys have beaten Flo Jo's Women's 100m world record.

 

[bobzmyunkle]

'During the 2023 world championships in her home city, the official programme and BBC coverage deadnamed York'

I do hope they severely whipped themselves for the transgression.

I note IanH is once again ignoring the questions that don't suite his position.

 

[Ian H]

'During the 2023 world championships in her home city, the official programme and BBC coverage deadnamed York'

I do hope they severely whipped themselves for the transgression.

I note IanH is once again ignoring the questions that don't suite his position.

I'm not ignoring anything. Just skating over the crap.
I still think not much has advanced from Claud's original post.

 

[CXRAndy]

We are at this point now in the debate

Anyone who thinks males don't have a physical advantage over women in virtually all sports is a willfull dumb fûck

 

[AndyRM]

Good news for women's rights around abortion laws:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c2le12114j9o

 

[CXRAndy]

Good news for women's rights around abortion laws:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c2le12114j9o

I agree with the criminal prosecution of the woman to be lifted. However I believe strict time limits for termination should be adhered to.

Medical practitioners should face prosecution if they ignore time limits without valid medical reason, backed by third party agreement

Only in medical emergency should a pregnancy should terminate after set limits, currently 20 weeks

 

[Bromptonaut]

I agree with the criminal prosecution of the woman to be lifted. However I believe strict time limits for termination should be adhered to.

Medical practitioners should face prosecution if they ignore time limits without valid medical reason, backed by third party agreement

Only in medical emergency should a pregnancy should terminate after set limits, currently 20 weeks

Which is pretty much the situation once the amendment adopted yesterday becomes law.

 

[icowden]

Medical practitioners should face prosecution if they ignore time limits without valid medical reason, backed by third party agreement
Only in medical emergency should a pregnancy should terminate after set limits, currently 20 weeks

So you want rules to stop something that doesn't happen and likely wouldn't happen from happening. Sounds entirely sensible.

 

[monkers]

N here.

Just to let you know monkers passed last week.

CXRAndy - legal point - the abortion limit is 24 weeks not 20 as you stated.

Final point re: monkers on Twitter. Monkers never had a Twitter account. Years ago she had a small spat with a Green Party activist. As an act of spite, the father of that person opened a Twitter account in her name and used her image. He made a number of Tweets which produced a bit of Twitter storm. Later this man was sentenced to a very long prison sentence on unrelated very serious sexual offences.