Jubilee - celebrate, ignore or bemoan?

[mudsticks]

Which is a good argument for at least changing the names of the awards to something relevant today.

I agree by being associated with or named for 'Empire' it sends an outdated, old-fashioned backwards looking message.
Which harks back to a less than edifying time in our history.

Something.more modern and egalitarian, aspirational for how we'd like to become , would be more useful imo .

I might even accept one , in the highly unlikely event it were proffered

 

[Rusty Nails]

While we still are a monarchy I see no reason to be concerned about any links in the names of honours to that monarchy, but I do see it as totally unnecessary, irrelevant and outdated to have any reference at all in those honours to the British Empire which, whatever your views about it, no longer exists.

 

[Deleted member 28]

Yup it's up to the individual, of course .

I think some more up to date scheme , without Empire baggage would be favourable for the modern age though .



Where do I say I don't like other opinions .??
I just don't always agree with them, and say why.
If I didn't want to hear different opinions I wouldn't be here..

Are you saying I should agree with them all.??
What happened to freedom of thought?
Or does that only cut one way??


When I say 'we' I'm referring to people also active in various forms of social justice activism.. No 'everyone in the world'
I'd have thought that was obvious..
But clearly not.


You appear to have a very absolutist mindset about a lot of things, including me and my opinion..

But you mustn't fall into having a go at me personally though, because apparently some people on here really don't like that kind of behaviour ..

Oh , hang on a minute, it appears they do like it sometimes -

- approval has come from the usual quarter it would seem ...

How curious...

Ps - is it only me who 'lectures' in your view There plenty longer posts than mine that don't attract such criticism..
Wonder why that is then ??



I'm not saying anyone else should or shouldn't accept an award, I'm just saying I find it odd when people who have made their names being 'anti establishment' in one way or another
Suddenly do accept , PT has clearly stuck by his principals.

Most of these more 'humble' sorts who get offered one have been nominated by their community, sector, or whatever..

The nomination is the recognition imo.
From those who nominated, not so much the royalty or Empire bit.

Some people would love getting one, that's up to them.

Personally having spent a lot of my time engaged in activities which are trying however obliquely, to undo many of the effects of 'Empire' 'colonialism' 'establishment hierachies' and other forms of entrenched exploitation and injustice, I'd find it pretty weird to accept anything with the words 'of the British Empire' in it.

As to my mind that institution has caused untold suffering and hardship across the globe.

Accepting an award in its name would go against most of what I believe in .

Not that there's much risk of it happening anyhow, so it's not my biggest worry right now..



Some of my friends are very whatever too ..

You expect me to read that lot!

 

[newfhouse]

You expect me to read that lot!

Not really.

 

[Rusty Nails]

You expect me to read that lot!

QED

 

[Deleted member 28]

So, to be clear, are you in favour of deference and inherited privilege? If so, why?

I don't mind it one bit, it makes no difference to me in the real scheme of things (nor you I would imagine) so I can't see why it gets people's back's up?

Never understood the 'Anti Royal' thing myself but I suppose I'm English.

 

[mudsticks]

You expect me to read that lot!

Nope , not all of it, that would be waayyy too big an ask.

But, if you have a quiet moment you might manage to read my response to your directly addressing me .

Whatever happened to 'opinionate away'

Here's an idea though, if you don't like what I write, just ignore it, don't respond .

Honestly, I'd cope just fine

 

[Deleted member 28]

I agree by being associated with or named for 'Empire' it sends an outdated, old-fashioned backwards looking message.

Again, in your opinion.

I bet you lot will be turning all Gammon when the Jubilee celebrations start and the flags are all out in the villages around the country.

 

[newfhouse]

Changing the names of the awards wouldn't remove bad events from history.
What's wrong with accepting the "baggage" of empire? We're all part of it. Most of us are related to someone with strong connections.

What about those who deserved awards, and recieved recognition back in the day - are you going to retrospectively change all the MBEs etc?

It's not about removing the events from history. My objection is to the wallowing in questionable glories.

Few of us have a choice about "accepting" the baggage of empire but that doesn't mean we should celebrate the past uncritically. I suggest a clean break and a recognition of good deeds done in the recent past would be a good thing.

 

[Deleted member 28]

Nope , not all of it, that would be waayyy too big an ask.

But, if you have a quiet moment you might manage to read my response to your directly addressing me .

Whatever happened to 'opinionate away'

Here's an idea though, if you don't like what I write, just ignore it, don't respond .

Honestly, I'd cope just fine

I just want to make sure you actually accept the fact there are other opinions and views of the country than the ones you hold.

 

[Deleted member 28]

It's like Disgusted of Tunbridge Wells still using his army rank 50yrs after having retired.

And?

If you were a Doctor but then retired you may still like being referred to as such.

Why do you even give a f**k anyway?

 

[winjim]

Agreed. Just about any "civilisation" you look at, had some less savoury aspects, how about the Romans and Slavery/Gladiators/etc etc, should we demolish all ancient Roman monuments, should the Italians be forever sorry for what the Romans did, I daresay those ancient Greeks did a few not so nice things............

Personally, I am more interested in looking to the future for better times, than, to the past for bad events.

The most excellent order of the British Empire was created only a few years before the birth of the current monarch. I'd say in the scheme of things that's fairly recent precedent for changing the system or creating a new one.

Changing the names of the awards wouldn't remove bad events from history.
What's wrong with accepting the "baggage" of empire? We're all part of it. Most of us are related to someone with strong connections.

What about those who deserved awards, and recieved recognition back in the day - are you going to retrospectively change all the MBEs etc?

The most excellent order of British Egalitarianism?

 

[mudsticks]

Again, in your opinion.

I bet you lot will be turning all Gammon when the Jubilee celebrations start and the flags are all out in the villages around the country.

Yes in my opinion..

Remember? That thing I'm allowed too

Who is 'us lot'.??

You think people who aren't that keen on the RF, will start getting all frothy about the 'political correctness' implicit in flags??

You really are a rather confused chap .

Personally I'll probs be on a far northern Scottish hillside , or elsewise having a bit of knees up in Glasgow with second born son..

I suspect neither 'street parties' nor flags will be figuring much in any of it.

 

[mudsticks]

I just want to make sure you actually accept the fact there are other opinions and views of the country than the ones you hold.

Where or when have I ever implied otherwise.??

You think I only ever talk to people who agree with me..??

Only read stuff written by people who agree with me


That's what you've claimed to do in the past..

Not I.

Anyhow more work calls..

 

[Ian H]

And?

If you were a Doctor but then retired you may still like being referred to as such.

Why do you even give a f**k anyway?

It's generally considered poor form to use a military rank after retirement (but not Dr., as you doubtless know).
You appear to have missed what I was alluding to.
I take a general interest in what goes on around me and in the wider world, and even have opinions about stuff.