Random political stuff - old news, or not news

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briantrumpet

briantrumpet

Timewaster
I saw one of those social media graphics to which I thought 'Yeah, right', then looked up the person in question, and it turns out to be absolutely true. It's symptomatic of how lobby groups work that a 'scientist' *employed by the lead-producing manufacturers* tried to rubbish Patterson's advocacy against lead products.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clair_Patterson

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monkers

Shaman
I saw one of those social media graphics to which I thought 'Yeah, right', then looked up the person in question, and it turns out to be absolutely true. It's symptomatic of how lobby groups work that a 'scientist' *employed by the lead-producing manufacturers* tried to rubbish Patterson's advocacy against lead products.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clair_Patterson

View attachment 16433

Thanks for raising this. I was aware of Patterson.

If you are interested in the topic area and not just the man, also check out Herbert Needleman. He also has a fascinating history.

https://www.healthandenvironment.or...erbert-needleman-faced-down-the-lead-industry
 

icowden

Pharaoh
An interesting turn of phrase here, implying that parts of Britain didn't qualify to get rained on somehow...

"Yes Andy, The lads did their best - put in a blinding bid... They threw everything at it - full power point, costings, but on this occasion they just missed out and the rain funding has gone to Manchester. Over to Keith now for a local report..."

"Thanks Emily... I'm here in Manchester where the Northern Powerhouse Bid package narrowly beat out the south. The end result of course is a small amount of rain - 0.5cm overnight, which is a huge result for local farmers and firefighters... better luck to the South next time, where we are hearing that... yes... Nigel Farage has promised 7 years of plenty with sufficient rain for all, provided that you all vote for him and someone bungs him £10mil..."
 

AndyRM

Elder Goth
"Yes Andy, The lads did their best - put in a blinding bid... They threw everything at it - full power point, costings, but on this occasion they just missed out and the rain funding has gone to Manchester. Over to Keith now for a local report..."

"Thanks Emily... I'm here in Manchester where the Northern Powerhouse Bid package narrowly beat out the south. The end result of course is a small amount of rain - 0.5cm overnight, which is a huge result for local farmers and firefighters... better luck to the South next time, where we are hearing that... yes... Nigel Farage has promised 7 years of plenty with sufficient rain for all, provided that you all vote for him and someone bungs him £10mil..."

Quality, chapeau sir!
 
OP
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briantrumpet

briantrumpet

Timewaster
Christina Pagel was annoyed about the News Agents claiming that school closures during covid weren't necessary, mostly because they didn't reference the modelling that showed how much worse it could have been had schools not closed (especially during the first wave, when everyone was ignorant, there was no vaccine, and hospitals were overwhelmed).

https://skywriter.blue/@chrischirp.bsky.social/3mrwx74y5x223

Prof Christina Pagel
July 31, 2026 at 2:25 PM GMT+2

🧵On @thenewsagents.co.uk yesterday, school closures and the lab leak theory were offered as two examples of legitimate questions that were hard to ask. Both have in fact been asked constantly since 2020. But here's a thread on why I think they were wrong and dangerous on school closures 1/12 @lewisgoodall.com / @jonsopel1.bsky.social said "I am not sure that even in the first lockdown, school closures for any length of time were a price worth paying." But no discussion of the alternative. The alternative was never "schools open and everything else the same".

2/12 March 2020: no testing, no treatment, no vaccine, admissions doubling every 3 to 4 days. Countries ahead of us closed schools alongside everything else, so nobody had evidence separating the two. We didn't know much about Covid in children and nothing about long term impact 3/12 Several studies have since shown definitely that children and schools contribute signficantly to transmission. In Sweden (with no formal lockdown), parents and teachers of pupils at school had higher infection rates. Children live with and are taught by adults. Many are vulnerable adults.

4/12 After 1st wave, we didn't run summer catch up programmes or improve ventilation in schools - we didn't even try until 2021, months after the last school closures. We didn't recommend masks (let alone good masks) in classrooms until after the last school closures. 5/12 We did in fact try lockdown with schools fully open in November 2020. It worked initially, but cases in London & SE started rising again *before* lockdown even ended, because of new variant Alpha. Lockdown with schools open was not enough! 6/12 In fact, modelling on contact and case data estimated that if schools had remained open during the final Jan-March 2021 lockdown, it would barely have brought R below 1. I've already written about that devastating wave in which 87,000 people died. 7/12 christinapagel.substack.com

The UK Covid Inquiry has laid bare the avoidable horror of the second Covid wave
christinapagel.substack.com

And covid was not harmless to children. Being at lower risk than adults does not mean harmless. There was acute illness needing hospital, late onset rare but serious inflammatory disease, Long Covid and 13,000 UK children who lost a parent. (more details in substack post at end) 8/12 Keeping schools open is a goal not a policy. A blanket "never close schools" is a bad lesson.

I suggest these: 1. Do not prejudge next pandemic which will be a different virus and could have very different age profile of who it attacks 9/12 2. Clean indoor air: helpful in a pandemic and good for health and learning at all times (and not just in schools but other buildings too) 3. Effective public health measures: testing, contact tracing, support for isolation, communication, etc 10/12 4. Support for children in disadvantaged communities, inc devices, connectivity, food, safe spaces to learn, catch-up teaching 5. Dedicated and planned mental health and social support if school closures become necessary 6. Build capacity to generate evidence more rapidly for the next time 11/12 More detail with links to evidence and a nice chart in my substack post 12/12 christinapagel.substack.com

We are learning the wrong lesson from Covid school closures
christinapagel.substack.com
 

Pross

Guru
There's been a lot of reviewing going on based on what we knew in late 2020 or into 2021 rather than what we knew in April / May of 2020. Maybe the politicians / policy makers should have better modelled for something along the lines of what happened but from my position of ignorance it seems that the virus was different to the sort of thing they had been planning for and there was then a frantic attempt to catch up. This wasn't just a UK issue either. I also think people have forgotten just how scared people were in that first wave, even if schools had stayed open I suspect many parents would have chosen to keep their kids at home.
 
OP
OP
briantrumpet

briantrumpet

Timewaster
There's been a lot of reviewing going on based on what we knew in late 2020 or into 2021 rather than what we knew in April / May of 2020. Maybe the politicians / policy makers should have better modelled for something along the lines of what happened but from my position of ignorance it seems that the virus was different to the sort of thing they had been planning for and there was then a frantic attempt to catch up. This wasn't just a UK issue either. I also think people have forgotten just how scared people were in that first wave, even if schools had stayed open I suspect many parents would have chosen to keep their kids at home.

A lot of it is RW loons trying to rubbish the whole thing, as we can see particularly with Fauci and the Republicans... I think they are pissed off that more poor people didn't die from catching it in crowded public schools and workplaces, while they swanned around in their mansions and air-conditioned cadillacs being chauffeured by their black servants.

Rupert 'Reject' Lowe is saying he'd want to jail Chris Whitty.
 

LCpl Boiled Egg

Active Member
I also think people have forgotten just how scared people were in that first wave, even if schools had stayed open I suspect many parents would have chosen to keep their kids at home.

My wife and I took our son out of school a week before the schools closed, and I'd do it again if I had to. As someone who was clinically vulnerable enough that I didn't leave my house for over four months, that extra week of exposure could have made me very ill, or worse.
 
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briantrumpet

briantrumpet

Timewaster
I just find it really interesting (without wanting to go over the whole debate again - I think the thread on Cake Stop was hundreds of pages long) how it seems to have turned into a tribal thing, especially in the US – it's a bit like Badenoch telling Tory MPs that they have to be against Net Zero to be in her tribe.

The loons are hoping that not enough people will remember just how scary it all was, though I suspect people working in hospitals will not forget in a hurry, as the bodies piled up.
 
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OP
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briantrumpet

briantrumpet

Timewaster
Lewis Goodall is getting dragged for this... it sprang from a discussion in which he opined that school shutdowns might have been an overreaction.

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Pblakeney

Shaman
Not news. Saw this in a shelter at the top of the Mortirolo and it displays all that is wrong with cycling in the UK.
13 top quality closed road sportives (specifically not races). All free to enter.

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