Starmer's vision quest

[secretsqirrel]

Means tested benefits are Universal Credit, Pension Credit and Housing Benefit and Council Tax Support.

Don’t think there are any others?

 

[BoldonLad]

No child benefit is not means tested.

Isn't it "clawed back" when one earner is earning in excess of a certain figure (£80,000pa I think, is the point that it is totally "clawed back")

 

[secretsqirrel]

Isn't it "clawed back" when one earner is earning in excess of a certain figure (£80,000pa I think, is the point that it is totally "clawed back")

If it was means tested they wouldn’t get it in the first place.

 

[BoldonLad]

If it was means tested they wouldn’t get it in the first place.

OK. I can accept that. It was the current use (not on here) of the term "means tested" when discussing WFA and State Pension which made me doubt the meaning of the term "Means Tested"

 

[Bromptonaut]

If they'd done some jiggery pokery with the Warm Homes thingy when abolishing WFA they might not have been in the mess they were.

I also find it ironic that while the media generated so much heat over WFA that cuts to disability benefits, particularly removal of various premiums when legacy benefits moved to Universal Credit, never scored a single headline.

And I could say the same about 'flipping' the rules for Pension Credit so that couples have to subsist on UC until the younger hits Pension Age.

 

[Pross]

If they'd done some jiggery pokery with the Warm Homes thingy when abolishing WFA they might not have been in the mess they were.

I also find it ironic that while the media generated so much heat over WFA that cuts to disability benefits, particularly removal of various premiums when legacy benefits moved to Universal Credit, never scored a single headline.

And I could say the same about 'flipping' the rules for Pension Credit so that couples have to subsist on UC until the younger hits Pension Age.

There seems to be a narrative that ‘pensioners’ = ‘poor’ and whilst there are a lot of people with no / bad workplace pension provision that struggle through later life there are also many who are living comfortably, often with more disposable income than those still in work. I would say more of the retired people I know fall into the latter camp and a lot of them retired early.

There’s another irony that many of those who get vocal about any financial ‘right’ being cut to pensioners will be equally vocal about the lazy working-age benefit claimants (the same for their bibles like the Mail, Express and Telegraph).

The usual argument is that it is hard to do means testing and it costs more than making a benefit universal but you would think in this technological era it should be pretty simple.

 

[CXRAndy]

Goods news RFA has only the second ever highest May interest payment. £7,600,000,000. That's right 7.6 billion in interest payments.

Get the frigging deficit down, cut waste, get rid of free loaders, make some massive cutbacks.

Oh and retail sales slump again- 2.7% down.

She's taxed and borrowed the UKs public finances to the hilt

 

[BoldonLad]

There seems to be a narrative that ‘pensioners’ = ‘poor’ and whilst there are a lot of people with no / bad workplace pension provision that struggle through later life there are also many who are living comfortably, often with more disposable income than those still in work. I would say more of the retired people I know fall into the latter camp and a lot of them retired early.

There’s another irony that many of those who get vocal about any financial ‘right’ being cut to pensioners will be equally vocal about the lazy working-age benefit claimants (the same for their bibles like the Mail, Express and Telegraph).

The usual argument is that it is hard to do means testing and it costs more than making a benefit universal but you would think in this technological era it should be pretty simple.

Isn't this the Politics of envy, divide and conquer, very much Mail, Express and Telegraph country?

The grass always looks greener on the other side of the hill.

Given today's technology, I would have thought a seamless tax/benefit system should be perfectly possible, it is the will to make it happen which is lacking. The problem with subsidies/benefits/perks is they are very easy to introduce, but, very difficult to get rid of.

 

[Stevo 666]

I know, I'm at the intellectual level of Truss and Kwarteng here.

You could at least try to debate. It's more satisfying than making smartarse quips and half arsed trolling attempts 😉

 

[bobzmyunkle]

There seems to be a narrative that ‘pensioners’ = ‘poor’ and whilst there are a lot of people with no / bad workplace pension provision that struggle through later life there are also many who are living comfortably, often with more disposable income than those still in work. I would say more of the retired people I know fall into the latter camp and a lot of them retired early.

There’s another irony that many of those who get vocal about any financial ‘right’ being cut to pensioners will be equally vocal about the lazy working-age benefit claimants (the same for their bibles like the Mail, Express and Telegraph).

The usual argument is that it is hard to do means testing and it costs more than making a benefit universal but you would think in this technological era it should be pretty simple.

Or maybe the consideration was that some pensioners will be too proud to claim means tested benefit, so give it to every one of them.
Maybe we could look at the level of the state pension and the level of tax allowance compared to similar nations in Europe. By GDP the UK is the 6th (or maybe 9th) richest nation - where does all the money go?

 

[farfromtheland]

I also find it ironic that while the media generated so much heat over WFA that cuts to disability benefits, particularly removal of various premiums when legacy benefits moved to Universal Credit, never scored a single headline.

This.

 

[farfromtheland]

Given today's technology, I would have thought a seamless tax/benefit system should be perfectly possible, it is the will to make it happen which is lacking. The problem with subsidies/benefits/perks is they are very easy to introduce, but, very difficult to get rid of.

A seamless tax/benefits system depends on us all being monitored in the minutiae of our spending. Perhaps this is a bad idea?

I don't like 'subsidies/benefits/perks' being concatenated. Social housing is nominated subsidised when it's actually our common wealth. We wouldn't need all the benefits if so much of them didn't go to the landlord's pockets. Perks are the domain of business corruption.

 

[farfromtheland]

It wasn't easy to get decent council housing - it was the result of a long fight after people came back from the war to face homelessness. It was easier - though not quick either - to get rid of it by appealing to self-interest instead.

 

[CXRAndy]

No big deal-only a few murdered at the carnival. Shut it down for good


View: https://x.com/TheGriftReport/status/1935798624962986306?t=huqNiJPIP_9-SsktU5PDZA&s=19

 

[CXRAndy]

View: https://x.com/RupertLowe10/status/1935589702184358291?t=HG6RFrgS0NM-MSYqWy7SOQ&s=19