Starmer's vision quest

[CXRAndy]

Uk economy shrunk again in May

 

[bobzmyunkle]

You do realise what tax avoidance is?
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/tax-avoidance-an-introduction

Here's the relevant bit: "Tax avoidance involves bending the rules of the tax system to try to gain a tax advantage that Parliament never intended."

Given that ISA's are allowed by the law and are intended to give a tax benefit, can you explain to us how ISAs constitute tax avoidance?

@Stevo 666, once again you're being a bit slow. I was criticising the stance taken by others who were arguing that ISAs were an example of tax avoidance. Please keep up at the back.

 

[CXRAndy]

What did Macron steal from Charles?


View: https://x.com/cornholio74/status/1942677951620755517?t=IBUrYZSpsHAneVD9qqByJw&s=19

 

[AndyRM]

Slow news day for GBeebies?

 

[Pross]

Well quite.

@Pross have you never done gift aid for a charitable contribution?

I thinkmy comment was misunderstood. I was simply talking about people who are already incredibly rich simply wanting t get richer and avoid having to give any of that money away in taxes. My comment of helping others was more that if I had the level of wealth to ensure myself and my family had all they could ever need I would hope that I would then use any excess to help others whether directly or indirectly (i.e. through paying all taxes due without getting complex, albeit legal, schemes to avoid that). I just don't get billionaires etc. going to such lengths to avoid paying out.

 

[All uphill]

I thinkmy comment was misunderstood. I was simply talking about people who are already incredibly rich simply wanting t get richer and avoid having to give any of that money away in taxes. My comment of helping others was more that if I had the level of wealth to ensure myself and my family had all they could ever need I would hope that I would then use any excess to help others whether directly or indirectly (i.e. through paying all taxes due without getting complex, albeit legal, schemes to avoid that). I just don't get billionaires etc. going to such lengths to avoid paying out.

I volunteer with asylum seekers. To many of them we Boomers are enormously wealthy; does that mean we should give away lots of our wealth?

Probably, I'd say, but don't do...

 

[Psamathe]

Here's the relevant bit: "Tax avoidance involves bending the rules of the tax system to try to gain a tax advantage that Parliament never intended."

Given that ISA's are allowed by the law and are intended to give a tax benefit, can you explain to us how ISAs constitute tax avoidance?

How does one know "what the Government intended?". Law is the law. We cannot have a tax system based on what we or you or somebody else might think Parliament intended as our interpretations might be different, some might not have been listening to the debate the entire time, etc.

Ian

 

[CXRAndy]

 

[AndyRM]

It's gonna be cute to see what the Daily Mail lead with on Monday.

 

[Ian H]

How does one know "what the Government intended?". Law is the law. We cannot have a tax system based on what we or you or somebody else might think Parliament intended as our interpretations might be different, some might not have been listening to the debate the entire time, etc.

Ian

Gov announces a new tax regulation. Business lobbies for exemptions. Reg goes into law with exemptions. Tax experts work out how far they can stretch any exemptions (if the law isn't tightly drafted, there could be a lot of stretching). Then one of three things happen: a) nothing; b) HMRC declares some stretches unlawful (perhaps retrospectively - cue unhappy celebs); c) Gov changes the law (and the process starts again).

 

[CXRAndy]

View: https://x.com/Basil_TGMD/status/1943570160620630101?t=TLs5JkvFeUhP-NyBsRoeAw&s=19

 

[Stevo 666]

How does one know "what the Government intended?". Law is the law. We cannot have a tax system based on what we or you or somebody else might think Parliament intended as our interpretations might be different, some might not have been listening to the debate the entire time, etc.

Ian

It is plainly obvious that ISA's are deigned to shelter investment income from tax. Here's the link to the Government webpage where they explain it.
https://www.gov.uk/individual-savings-accounts

The statement on there "You can save tax-free with Individual Savings Accounts (ISAs)." is clear enough to me. How about you?

 

[Stevo 666]

@Stevo 666, once again you're being a bit slow. I was criticising the stance taken by others who were arguing that ISAs were an example of tax avoidance. Please keep up at the back.

No. You said:
bobzmyunkle said:
"ISAs are tax avoidance and therefore equivalent to all other forms of tax avoidance. So there's no moral difference between saving a few quid in an ISA and any of those convoluted schemes that people pay their accountants to set up.
You've convinced me guys. Well actually you haven't but I'm just one of those whinging lefties and no doubt a hypocrite according to your puerile logic"

I've highlighted the relevant part in bold above in case you forgot what you said.

 

[Stevo 666]

I thinkmy comment was misunderstood. I was simply talking about people who are already incredibly rich simply wanting t get richer and avoid having to give any of that money away in taxes. My comment of helping others was more that if I had the level of wealth to ensure myself and my family had all they could ever need I would hope that I would then use any excess to help others whether directly or indirectly (i.e. through paying all taxes due without getting complex, albeit legal, schemes to avoid that). I just don't get billionaires etc. going to such lengths to avoid paying out.

Fair enough, but your statement in bold is a bit of a generalised assumption.

 

[Pross]

Fair enough, but your statement in bold is a bit of a generalised assumption.

Not really as it is specifically talking about those rich people that take that view and is therefore the complete opposite of a generalisation. I've got no issue with people who are rich beyond most people's dreams but pay that dues to the rest of society, preferably without milking loopholes to minimise those dues.