Starmer's vision quest

[Pross]

Only in the cohort, not the principle which is "pay people I don't like to go away".

Not really, it’s people who’ve already lost the argument over their right to stay and trying to persuade them to leave quickly whilst reducing the legal cost of an appeal (which appears to have around a 30% success rate from the information I can find). Griffin was looking to pay British citizens to leave the country based on their colour. It’s very different

 

[Shortfall]

I mean, I was born in '74, and I agree that life has changed massively. But my dad raised 4 kids on what was the equivalent of minimum wage clerical job. This paid a mortgage on a suburban 3 bed semi, a car, and my mum stayed home

We'd more than one pair of jeans (each) and more than satsumas at Xmas.

In fairness to her, she did go to school on 'estate'.....it was on 20 acres

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I'm conflicted here cos I'm Gen X so I can remember how sh1t it was in the 70s and early 80s and I remember the power cuts and Dad being on strike but I also remember him buying a house for 2k in 1972 and selling it for 120k in 1988 and all he had to do was live in it. And then I remember having to buy my first house in a slum area when interest rates were at 15% and the previous couple of decades of house price inflation has taken a 2 bed semi out of the reach of my fairly decent salary. So I have empathy for today's kids who will never own a house and are so totally disenfranchised that they think the lunatic fringe nutters like Zak Polanski are worth voting for cos he's gonna give them free sh1t. That is until I see that so many of them would rather sleep until lunchtime in their parents house and let immigrants (literally) wipe people's backsides for minimum wage because they can't be @rsed. I don't have any answers except to say that one of my kids who is in his 30s has worked his butt off and is doing ok because he didn't spunk what little money he had on a new iPhone every 18 months and a BMW on a PCP, so my real world sample.of one says it can be done.

 

[icowden]

So I have empathy for today's kids who will never own a house and are so totally disenfranchised that they think the lunatic fringe nutters like Zak Polanski are worth voting for cos he's gonna give them free sh1t.

I'm not sure he counts as lunatic fringe. He's one of the more hinged politicians available to us.

 

[Shortfall]

I'm not sure he counts as lunatic fringe. He's one of the more hinged politicians available to us.

He really is lunatic fringe and I'm afraid you're probably going to find out the hard way that I'm right about that. What I find curious from reading your various contributions on here is that you see people voting for Farage's style of populism as beneath contempt but you simultaneously think that Polanski's different brand of extremist sh1te is somehow acceptable. It's all borne out of the same thing. The mainstream politicians have totally failed us all and desperate people of whatever persuasion will vote for whoever isn't one of the tarnished brands. Let me spell it out. Polanski is an absolute nutter. HTH.

 

[icowden]

What I find curious from reading your various contributions on here is that you see people voting for Farage's style of populism as beneath contempt

Yes, because we have strong evidence that it is. We have very strong evidence the Farage is a shyster who goes whichever way the wind blows and is content to make money out of racism and xenophobia by pretending to be a "man of the people".

but you simultaneously think that Polanski's different brand of extremist sh1te is somehow acceptable. It's all borne out of the same thing.

Yet, you fail to mention anything that you think is extremist about Polanski's position. He supports legalisation and regulation of hard drugs - a policy which has been evidenced to work in other countries. He advocates renationalising the water companies which many people agree with. He <shock horror> believes in strong environmental policies - increasing the use of renewable energy and taxing wealth to drive it. He wants closer ties with Europe.

Perhaps you are concerned about his extremist views that trans people should have been involved in the Cass Report conversations and that he disagrees with it. Or is it his extremist views that the UK should leave NATO in favour of an alternative security alliance that doesn't involve America is it's a completely unstable dictatorship run by a madman? His support for pushing for Nuclear disarmament - is that extremist to you?

I don't agree with all of his policies, but I don't think any of them are that extreme.

 

[bobzmyunkle]

I'm conflicted here cos I'm Gen X so I can remember how sh1t it was in the 70s and early 80s and I remember the power cuts

Sorry dude but in the 70s we believed in progress. Gen X f*cked it up with their loadsa money delusions (generalisation obviously). It wasn't sh1t, we had fun. Just to be clear, I'm not from the privileged classes.

 

[Shortfall]

Yes, because we have strong evidence that it is. We have very strong evidence the Farage is a shyster who goes whichever way the wind blows and is content to make money out of racism and xenophobia by pretending to be a "man of the people".

Yet, you fail to mention anything that you think is extremist about Polanski's position. He supports legalisation and regulation of hard drugs - a policy which has been evidenced to work in other countries. He advocates renationalising the water companies which many people agree with. He <shock horror> believes in strong environmental policies - increasing the use of renewable energy and taxing wealth to drive it. He wants closer ties with Europe.

Perhaps you are concerned about his extremist views that trans people should have been involved in the Cass Report conversations and that he disagrees with it. Or is it his extremist views that the UK should leave NATO in favour of an alternative security alliance that doesn't involve America is it's a completely unstable dictatorship run by a madman? His support for pushing for Nuclear disarmament - is that extremist to you?

I don't agree with all of his policies, but I don't think any of them are that extreme.

Sure we can all pick out the bits of our favoured fruitcake's manifesto that sound reasonable. I mean Adolf was all about putting a halt to the rampant inflation that had destroyed the savings of hard working Germans. Who could argue with that? But anyway, as I like to say, stick around, there might well be a coalition of the Greens, Labour and the Lib Dems on the horizon and I look forward to reading about your conversion to go the right of the political spectrum after enduring a few years of that.

 

[icowden]

Sure we can all pick out the bits of our favoured fruitcake's manifesto that sound reasonable. I mean Adolf was all about putting a halt to the rampant inflation that had destroyed the savings of hard working Germans. Who could argue with that? But anyway, as I like to say, stick around, there might well be a coalition of the Greens, Labour and the Lib Dems on the horizon and I look forward to reading about your conversion to go the right of the political spectrum after enduring a few years of that.

So you still can't find a single extremist policy to give me as an example then? Thought not.

 

[Shortfall]

So you still can't find a single extremist policy to give me as an example then? Thought not.

I mean if you can't see anything extremist yourself then I can't help you. Are you still in the sixth form by any chance? Someone once warned me about playing chess with a squirrel.
Good night x

 

[Rusty Nails]

I mean if you can't see anything extremist yourself then I can't help you. Are you still in the sixth form by any chance? Someone once warned me about playing chess with a squirrel.
Good night x

Nice try, but still no answer.

You’re the one who’s hiding his nuts.

Good morning.

 

[briantrumpet]

I'm watching various threads on the Glasman thing about Iraq, and everyone is going "WTF?"

I'd need to check this out, but if true, no wonder he doesn't fit too well in a progressive party... that's some alliance of... erm...?

 

[briantrumpet]

Bloomin' 'eck! 😱

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alliance_for_Responsible_Citizenship

 

[C R]

I'm watching various threads on the Glasman thing about Iraq, and everyone is going "WTF?"

I'd need to check this out, but if true, no wonder he doesn't fit too well in a progressive party... that's some alliance of... erm...?

View attachment 13689

I think the word you were looking for is ärseholes.

 

[briantrumpet]

I think the word you were looking for is ärseholes.

That's more letters than I'd normally use.

 

[AuroraSaab]

So you still can't find a single extremist policy to give me as an example then? Thought not.

I wouldn't call them extremist in the usual political sense of the word but they do have some stupid ideas. Abolishing Ofsted is a stupid idea. They've backtracked on their very stupid policy of pushing 'natural' childbirth and seeking to reduce interventions - a policy which has historically led to devastating outcomes in some maternity services. They seem to have backtracked on leaving Nato of late. The gender stuff obviously is stupid. They want to intervene on tobacco and alcohol consumption whilst allowing people to purchase ghb, the drug of choice for drink spikers and rapists.

I'm leaving aside the question of where all the money is coming from to abolish tuition fees and do all the other 'jam tomorrow' stuff.