The Nasty Party (AKA the Tories), it's back!

[winjim]

Oh dear, I must tell Daughter No.1, she is going to be VERY disappointed

I am unable to interpret this response.

 

[BoldonLad]

It's possible to have worked since you were 15 and still be younger than Shep. HTH.

many things are possible.

I worked from 14 (although I am not younger than @shep), but, I don’t think my paper round or car cleaning job offered a pension scheme.

 

[BoldonLad]

I am unable to interpret this response.

Really? Not that difficult to figure out, I would have thought, but, just for you:

daughter no1 is a nurse in the NHS

she plans to retire at 55

 

[Deleted member 28]

A nurse employed under current conditions in the NHS will not be able to comfortably retire at 55 on a final salary pension. You say that people should plan for their pensions but you voted for the party which took away the very entitlements which you are enjoying.

So yeah, I don't like the word 'blame' but you are kind of partly responsible for that.

Things have changed since the 80's regarding pensions as we know, I doubt it's all down to the current Government though is it?

People are living longer so need more cash, If another party get in they can change it back.

 

[winjim]

Things have changed since the 80's regarding pensions as we know, I doubt it's all down to the current Government though is it?

The Cameron/Osborne administration significantly reduced the value of NHS pensions, including removing final salary entitlement, changing the way they are index linked to inflation and increasing employee contributions. There's also been an effective pay freeze, in some cases a pay cut in real terms I think, across the NHS for the period since then which includes all subsequent Tory administrations.

You voted for it, and that's fine if you think it's for the best, it's your right in a democracy. Just take some ownership of it and don't accuse others of poor planning when you have acted to remove their access to the benefits and entitlements which you are taking advantage of yourself.

 

[Ian H]

4. "The Rules" are not the Conservative party Rules, they are "The Commons" Rules.

I think that, in practice, that is no longer entirely true. Unfortunately.

 

[Deleted member 28]

The Cameron/Osborne administration significantly reduced the value of NHS pensions, including removing final salary entitlement, changing the way they are index linked to inflation and increasing employee contributions. There's also been an effective pay freeze, in some cases a pay cut in real terms I think, across the NHS for the period since then which includes all subsequent Tory administrations.

You voted for it, and that's fine if you think it's for the best, it's your right in a democracy. Just take some ownership of it and don't accuse others of poor planning when you have acted to remove their access to the benefits and entitlements which you are taking advantage of yourself.

You're concentrating solely on the NHS pension here, my missus worked for the NHS for over 30yrs so I'm pretty aware of how it works, she also voted Tory.

I doubt the fella in question has got an NHS pension? he was relying on being in the EU for his retirement plans apparently so everthing you've said is immaterial.

Do you honestly think the old superannuation scheme was sustainable without massive increases to contributions?

As for myself, I have a DC pension not a final salary scheme so not taking advantage of anything, apart from working for a company that pays in as well which I thought was now the law?

You just seem pissed off about anything and everything, you happy with any part of life?

 

[Bromptonaut]

Because I've worked since I was 15 and got a decent job and married a Woman who did the same?

Are those opportunities available to a 16yo joining the workforce today?

What you say about starting a pension early still holds true but you (and I) were, to put it bluntly, lucky. In your early working life you were probably getting tax relief at 30% plus on contributions, more if you hit higher rate. MIRAS freed up cash for your too. You also worked through a time of particularly good investment growth.

A nurse joining the NHS now, post University so say 22, will not have the additional years that one starting in the eighties and trained from scratch on the ward had. They will have to work until they're at least 67/8 and possibly longer. Their 'contributions' will be higher and the benefit less.

It also needs to be pointed out that most public sector schemes are unfunded; Mrs Shep's NHS pension and mine from the Civil Service are paid out of current tax receipts.

 

[Bromptonaut]

I doubt the fella in question has got an NHS pension? he was relying on being in the EU for his retirement plans apparently so everthing you've said is immaterial.

The fella can answer for himself but I don't think he though the EU would fund his retirement.

Issue is it's now much more difficult to retire in the remaining 27 countries.

 

[Deleted member 28]

So a

Are those opportunities available to a 16yo joining the workforce today?

What you say about starting a pension early still holds true but you (and I) were, to put it bluntly, lucky. In your early working life you were probably getting tax relief at 30% plus on contributions, more if you hit higher rate. MIRAS freed up cash for your too. You also worked through a time of particularly good investment growth.

A nurse joining the NHS now, post University so say 22, will not have the additional years that one starting in the eighties and trained from scratch on the ward had. They will have to work until they're at least 67/8 and possibly longer. Their 'contributions' will be higher and the benefit less.

It also needs to be pointed out that most public sector schemes are unfunded; Mrs Shep's NHS pension and mine from the Civil Service are paid out of current tax receipts.

So apart from who we voted for we're both enjoying the same benefits pension wise, I don't have a DB scheme by the way, yet I'm the bad guy and you're not?

My fund could disappear overnight whereas yours and my wife's is guaranteed, the main point I was making is whatever the situation you need to make provision from an early age.

There must be plenty on here with a decent pension yet people jump on me for stating the obvious, can't blame anyone else if you haven't planned for the future.

My kids are 19 & 22 and both pay into their respective schemes, I was self employed for 10 yrs and still paid into a private scheme which I then transferred into the Company one that I now work for.

 

[Deleted member 28]

The fella can answer for himself but I don't think he though the EU would fund his retirement.

My only way to retire has been taken away by Brexit. Don't bother asking cos I won't answer either.

Your guess is as good as mine but when someone gives me stick for preventing them from retiring because I voted for Brexit then I'm going to respond.

 

[glasgowcyclist]

I have to say I'm surprised the Tories didn't try to barge ahead with it and it appears they've done a u-turn.

I say 'appears' because there is no end to their conniving ways and they'll still want to avoid forthcoming scrutiny on misdeeds by Johnson and his gang.

https://www.thenational.scot/news/19694086.tory-government-u-turn-outrage-owen-paterson-scandal/

"The Conservative government's controversial plan to overhaul the standards system at Westminster in order to protect one MP found guilty of lobbying looks dead in the water after opposition, media, and trade unions erupted in outrage.​

​

Commons Leader Jacob Rees-Mogg said the vote on reviewing the disciplinary system and preventing the immediate suspension of Owen Paterson had “created a certain amount of controversy”. "​

 

[cookiemonster]

 

[LCpl Boiled Egg]

We're all the same, Family and friends come first, we work to provide for ourselves.

The difference is you don't give a shoot about anyone else beyond your circle of family and friends. Other people have empathy which you clearly lack.

 

[Xipe Totec]

The difference is you don't give a shoot about anyone else beyond your circle of family and friends. Other people have empathy which you clearly lack.

That, I think, is exactly it, and I think Shep's quite upfront about that. He'll correct me if I'm wrong but I think he believes everyone else really feels the same as he does, and those of us who claim otherwise are being disingenuous, dishonest and are ' virtue signalling'.