The Queen / The Monarchy

[Pale Rider]

But it's OK to call people "brainless" isn't it? (your words), so why object when that epithet is directed back to the originator?

How many more times?

If you insult me, which you are now doing in every post, I reserve the right to ping the odd one back.

No one has to give an in-depth analysis of why they like something, in this case the monarchy.

Just as you haven't given and cogent reason to dislike it.

Rather looks like a case of the green-eyed monster to me.

But no doubt you will tell me - in you usual pig-ignorant terms - I'm wrong about that.

 

[multitool]

How many more times?

If you insult me, which you are now doing in every post, I reserve the right to ping the odd one back.

Actually you've consistently insulted me. And, given the reaction of other posters to your arrival, this is your normal MO.

No one has to give an in-depth analysis of why they like something, in this case the monarchy.

On a thread about the monarchy, yes you do. Otherwise your posts are pretty meaningless. It's not that you won't, it's that you can't.

We both know this, so why play silly games.

Just as you haven't given and cogent reason to dislike it.

Rather looks like a case of the green-eyed monster to me.

But no doubt you will tell me - in you usual pig-ignorant terms - I'm wrong about that.

Well, you haven't asked, so I haven't. But I can. A monarchy is class privilege personified. It is the pinnacle of the aristocracy. We should not accept living with hereditary rulers of any form, especially embodied by such an anachronism. I would prefer a meritocracy. Most other societies have cast off the last vestiges of feudalism and so should we. It makes no sense.

To suggest envy as a motivation is puerile.

Functionally, as head of state, the monarch is useless and therefore pointless. The Queen allowed the unlawful prorogation of Parliament. If the HoS cannot provide a safety net against unlawful attacks on the democratic system then there is no point to the HoS.

We badly need a written constitution and social and institutional progress rather than regressive, dewy-eyed mythologising about an imperial past. The whole pomp and ceremony bullshit needs to be confined to the bin.

 

[BoldonLad]

Can we have @jowwy back please?

 

[Mr Celine]

With Sir Keith ruling out scrapping the two child limit I almost feel sorry for Prince Louis.

 

[AndyRM]

Ah, the old green eyed monster trope.

I wouldn't want the life of a royal, at all. I quite like Princess Anne I suppose.

 

[the snail]

Choosing our entire constitutional system on what appeals to tourists seems like a great idea.

Sell off buck palace to disney, Liitle Mermaid for head of state? Works for me!

 

[Pale Rider]

Actually you've consistently insulted me. And, given the reaction of other posters to your arrival, this is your normal MO.



On a thread about the monarchy, yes you do. Otherwise your posts are pretty meaningless. It's not that you won't, it's that you can't.

We both know this, so why play silly games.



Well, you haven't asked, so I haven't. But I can. A monarchy is class privilege personified. It is the pinnacle of the aristocracy. We should not accept living with hereditary rulers of any form, especially embodied by such an anachronism. I would prefer a meritocracy. Most other societies have cast off the last vestiges of feudalism and so should we. It makes no sense.

To suggest envy as a motivation is puerile.

Functionally, as head of state, the monarch is useless and therefore pointless. The Queen allowed the unlawful prorogation of Parliament. If the HoS cannot provide a safety net against unlawful attacks on the democratic system then there is no point to the HoS.

We badly need a written constitution and social and institutional progress rather than regressive, dewy-eyed mythologising about an imperial past. The whole pomp and ceremony bullshit needs to be confined to the bin.

Envy was only a suggestion because I was struggling to think of why anyone could get so worked up about the monarchy.

Unlike you, I and probably other monarchists, do not feel like we are under a feudal yoke.

That's because we are not.

If the monarchy were doing me any harm, I'd be right behind you with the banners and petrol bombs.

But the monarchy are not doing me, or anyone, any harm.

I like the pomp and circumstance, I like the idea we have something the world, and particularly the Yanks, respect and envy.

There would be a limit to what I'd be prepared to pay for that, but as @icowden pointed out, there's a good case for saying overall Royal earnings cover, or at least defray a large amount, of the upfront cost.

There were maybe too many hangers on, but The Queen and now Charles are dealing with that.

And what do I have to do to contribute to the success of the monarchy?

Nothing, which is another big attraction.

 

[multitool]

But the monarchy are not doing me, or anyone, any harm.

They are doing harm. They are the apex of one of the most unequal nations in Europe.

They are the standard bearers of unearned privilege.

Which leads me on to this...

I like the pomp and circumstance, I like the idea we have something the world, and particularly the Yanks, respect and envy..

They don't.

This is just an example of British exceptionalism, and is something we say about ourselves.

If you bothered to find out what other nations were saying about us during the coronation, they were laughing at us.

 

[Pale Rider]

They don't.

Impossible for anyone to know what everyone else thinks, but there are a few pointers.

I've seen loads of American tourists on interviews saying how wonderful they make the monarchy is.

Isn't there still a huge Princess Diana fanbase over there?

Some of that looks a bit weird to me, but it does exist.

The Yanks were unanimously made up when The Queen ordered the playing of the star spangled banner at the changing of the guard after 9/11.

Yet another masterstroke of soft diplomacy by her majesty.

It was obvious to see President Trump was absolutely made up to be awarded a state visit.

Soft soaping any US president is a worthwhile thing to do in the current climate, and only the monarch can do it in such an effective way.

Plenty of examples of other nations, particularly the Commonwealth nations, celebrating the Coronation with us.

That's several examples which immediately spring to mind of the good the Royal Family do.

You could attempt to answer those with your usual assertion 'you are talking shite', but it would be a little more convincing if you could construct a genuine argument.

 

[multitool]

You could attempt to answer those with your usual assertion 'you are talking shite', but it would be a little more convincing if you could construct a genuine argument.

Well, it's Argument by Assertion, from you.

I've just presented you with an argument. You've countered it with unevidenced personal opinion...."some American tourists said" isn't really that convincing, not least because hanging off the coat tails of Yank tourists desperate for their approval is not very redolent of the forward thinking powerhouse of a nation that I want the UK to be, rather than the sad, tired husk of a once great country unable to come to terms with loss of empire and clinging onto redundant symbolism rather than surging ahead through progress.

I feel your confidence in your own viewpoints as reflective of any sort of universal truth is unfounded. Your views are very much of the 'bloke down the pub' approach. No intellectual rigour, just bloviated and supercilious opinion.

 

[Deleted member 28]

Doesn't look so much fun cheering and waving at stratospherically rich people when there's nothing to open except food banks and prison ships.

Deedums, feeling a bit hard done by?

Self pity isn't an attractive trate don't you know.

 

[Deleted member 28]

View attachment 4293

You are in the age demographic that supports a monarchy. But look at the under 25s.

The monarchy in its current form has, at most, 25 years left.

It's inevitable.

If your prediction is true most on here will either be dead or stinking of pi$$ in a home somewhere so won't live to see it or be too monged to celebrate, that makes me happy.

 

[Pale Rider]

Well, it's Argument by Assertion, from you.

I've just presented you with an argument. You've countered it with unevidenced personal opinion...."some American tourists said" isn't really that convincing.

I feel your confidence in your own viewpoints as reflective of any sort of universal truth is unfounded. Your views are very much of the 'bloke down the pub' approach. No intellectual rigour, just bloviated and supercilious opinion.

Your anti-argument was long on assertion and very short to the point of absence on facts.

More of a 1950s style class war diatribe.

It was exactly like the bloke down the pub who doesn't like the monarchy.

To you, that's an insult because you attempt to set yourself on a higher plane.

I'm with the CC members - and management - who say the forum should be like a pub conversation.

 

[Deleted member 28]

How come all these self-loathing Tory bootlickers are quite so bloody sanctimonious?

How come so many sweaties are ginger and angry?

 

[multitool]

If your prediction is true most on here will either be dead or stinking of pi$$ in a home somewhere so won't live to see it or be too monged to celebrate, that makes me happy.

You seem bitter.