Can the (Met) police ever change?

[Ian H]

It's a bit of a cliché that Lefties will criticise plod whatever they do, but sometimes, well ...

...criticising them for shooting an unarmed black man is completely over the top?

 

[BoldonLad]

...criticising them for shooting an unarmed black man is completely over the top?

Would shooting an unarmed white man have been OK?

 

[Ian H]

Would shooting an unarmed white man have been OK?

Do you really not know the answer to that question?

 

[BoldonLad]

Do you really not know the answer to that question?

I know MY answer, not so sure about your's, otherwise, I wouldn't have asked you

 

[Ian H]

I know MY answer, not so sure about your's, otherwise, I wouldn't have asked you

Why did I mention the person's ethnicity? It wasn't for effect, it wasn't to make some hypothetical point.

 

[dutchguylivingintheuk]

I'm absolutely certain I know more about the operation of armed police in the UK, than you do.

i never claimed i known all about them, just responded to your one-liner and yes if you claim to know beter then me how the armed Police is trained and in which situations they come into action i think questioning the risks they need to take is a bit silly. and indeed makes me wonder if you are happy-er if more of them die because that how it sounded like.

I've no idea why you think any of this verbal arsegravy has anything to do with me or what I posted

more then one sentence is hard for you i see.

 

[BoldonLad]

Why did I mention the person's ethnicity? It wasn't for effect, it wasn't to make some hypothetical point.

That was not what I asked, but...

OK, that's the "wasn'ts" listed

 

[icowden]

...criticising them for shooting an unarmed black man is completely over the top?

Whilst not completely over the top, I think it does miss out on the fact that armed police in the UK are highly trained and well aware that any fired shot will result in an enquiry. It's not unreasonable therefore to think that if a shot was fired, the officer felt there was reasonable cause to shoot. The UK isn't the USA. Of course mistakes can be made, and new facts can be discovered after an event.

Whilst the shooting was unfortunate in that it was later discovered that Kaba did not have a gun in the car, the facts around the shooting are pretty clear. Chris Kaba wasn't a nice young man on his way to church. He was ordered to stop and tried to batter his way through a police roadblock. His car had been linked to a firearms incident , and after his death he was linked (with 6 other men) to a conspiracy to commit murder and GBH. He had previous for possessing an imitation firearm with intent to cause fear and served 4 years.

Charging the officer who shot Kaba with murder is clearly ludicrous. This was a planned police operation and the officer was working under direction doing a job in which his life was at risk. He followed his training, and Kaba died. Kaba wasn't killed because of his skin colour. He was killed because he presented a potential danger and refused to follow instruction from an armed unit. You could argue that he was killed because he was stupid rather than dangerous.

 

[Pale Rider]

Whilst not completely over the top, I think it does miss out on the fact that armed police in the UK are highly trained and well aware that any fired shot will result in an enquiry. It's not unreasonable therefore to think that if a shot was fired, the officer felt there was reasonable cause to shoot. The UK isn't the USA. Of course mistakes can be made, and new facts can be discovered after an event.

Whilst the shooting was unfortunate in that it was later discovered that Kaba did not have a gun in the car, the facts around the shooting are pretty clear. Chris Kaba wasn't a nice young man on his way to church. He was ordered to stop and tried to batter his way through a police roadblock. His car had been linked to a firearms incident , and after his death he was linked (with 6 other men) to a conspiracy to commit murder and GBH. He had previous for possessing an imitation firearm with intent to cause fear and served 4 years.

Charging the officer who shot Kaba with murder is clearly ludicrous. This was a planned police operation and the officer was working under direction doing a job in which his life was at risk. He followed his training, and Kaba died. Kaba wasn't killed because of his skin colour. He was killed because he presented a potential danger and refused to follow instruction from an armed unit. You could argue that he was killed because he was stupid rather than dangerous.

Agreed, from what we can gather.

On the face of it, the polis does seem to have been trigger happy.

Pointing his weapon is one thing, but discharging it should be a last resort, such as if the target is pointing something at the officer, or putting members of the public in mortal danger.

From what little we know, neither of those things happened in this case.

One would like to think the charging decision has been taken strictly on the evidence, and not in response to pressure from an increasingly vocal anti-police lobby.

 

[Mr Celine]

Whilst the shooting was unfortunate in that it was later discovered that Kaba did not have a gun in the car, the facts around the shooting are pretty clear. Chris Kaba wasn't a nice young man on his way to church. He was ordered to stop and tried to batter his way through a police roadblock. His car had been linked to a firearms incident , and after his death he was linked (with 6 other men) to a conspiracy to commit murder and GBH. He had previous for possessing an imitation firearm with intent to cause fear and served 4 years.

You missed out the bit where he jumped over the barriers at the tube station.

Or was that someone else?

 

[icowden]

You missed out the bit where he jumped over the barriers at the tube station.
Or was that someone else?

I think you are confusing Chris Kaba with Jean Claude Menezes.

 

[Pale Rider]

You missed out the bit where he jumped over the barriers at the tube station.

You might have something there - shooting barrier jumpers would cut down on fare evasion.

 

[Mr Celine]

I think you are confusing Chris Kaba with Jean Claude Menezes.

I think you are missing the point.

Menezes we were told jumped the barriers and ran into the tube station. Except it later transpired that he had calmly walked in, bought a newspaper, then walked through the barriers using his oyster card.

At this stage in the Kaba case I would be highly sceptical of anything said by the Met.

 

[AndyRM]

You might have something there - shooting barrier jumpers would cut down on fare evasion.

The majority of stations on Newcastle's Metro don't have barriers, and they aren't always closed. Makes things easier to just gun everyone down as they pass through.

 

[matticus]

I think you are confusing Chris Kaba with Jean Claude Menezes.

Some people do struggle telling folks with foreign names apart.