EU & Brexit Bunker

[BoldonLad]

Stewart Lee with a pungent simile

View attachment 11357

The problem with Labour exposing the disaster of Brexit is what did Labour(Corbyn) actually do to discourage a "Leave" vote, other than to sit on the fence?

 

[briantrumpet]

The problem with Labour exposing the disaster of Brexit is what did Labour(Corbyn) actually do to discourage a "Leave" vote, other than to sit on the fence?

Ha, if I ever dare to mentionon Bluesky his EU fence-sitting helping the Leave vote, I get the Corbynistas telling me how he was an enthusiastic Remainer... yeah, right.

 

[midlandsgrimpeur]

The problem with Labour exposing the disaster of Brexit is what did Labour(Corbyn) actually do to discourage a "Leave" vote, other than to sit on the fence?

I was working at a Uni dept. specialising in migration research at the time. We put on a series of Brexit debates inviting MP's and the like as panel members. The general feeling I got from Labour MP's (none of whom could be arsed to attend) was more apathy. I think they felt leave was never going to win and therefore their campaigning against it was a waste of time.

 

[Pblakeney]

I was working at a Uni dept. specialising in migration research at the time. We put on a series of Brexit debates inviting MP's and the like as panel members. The general feeling I got from Labour MP's (none of whom could be arsed to attend) was more apathy. I think they felt leave was never going to win and therefore their campaigning against it was a waste of time.

You'd like to think lessons would be learned.
Hope beating expectations.

 

[briantrumpet]

I was working at a Uni dept. specialising in migration research at the time. We put on a series of Brexit debates inviting MP's and the like as panel members. The general feeling I got from Labour MP's (none of whom could be arsed to attend) was more apathy. I think they felt leave was never going to win and therefore their campaigning against it was a waste of time.

I think that Corbyn was at heart more of a Glasman-type Leaver, as he could see that EU rules limited his options for the socialist utopia he envisaged, but as the party voted to support Remain, Corbyn did the absolute least he could, and with no enthusiasm.

But that's all by the by now, apart from Glasman still having Starmer's ear.

 

[BoldonLad]

I was working at a Uni dept. specialising in migration research at the time. We put on a series of Brexit debates inviting MP's and the like as panel members. The general feeling I got from Labour MP's (none of whom could be arsed to attend) was more apathy. I think they felt leave was never going to win and therefore their campaigning against it was a waste of time.

What excellent judgement they had, just shows how in touch with the Public Mood they were, and, still are. 😊

 

[BoldonLad]

I think that Corbyn was at heart more of a Glasman-type Leaver, as he could see that EU rules limited his options for the socialist utopia he envisaged, but as the party voted to support Remain, Corbyn did the absolute least he could, and with no enthusiasm.

But that's all by the by now, apart from Glasman still having Starmer's ear.

I have a slightly more cynical view I am afraid, I think Corbyn saw (even hoped) that it would be close run, and, would bring Cameron down, giving him a chance to ride to the rescue. He was right partially, it did cause the disintegration of the Conservatives, but, is Party before Country what you want from your potential PM?

 

[briantrumpet]

I have a slightly more cynical view I am afraid, I think Corbyn saw (even hoped) that it would be close run, and, would bring Cameron down, giving him a chance to ride to the rescue. He was right partially, it did cause the disintegration of the Conservatives, but, is Party before Country what you want from your potential PM?

That's even more cynical than me - good work!

 

[midlandsgrimpeur]

What excellent judgement they had, just shows how in touch with the Public Mood they were, and, still are. 😊

I was particularly pissed off at the time as I was absolutely convinced it was going to be close and could see how little people were taking it seriously. @briantrumpet posted a link to the Ken Clarke interview on The Newsagents and he says how he got into an argument with Cameron over the stupidity of calling for a Referendum. KC said pretty much the same, that Cameron thought remaining was a formality and their was little to worry about. I think the apathy came from all angles.

 

[Psamathe]

I have a slightly more cynical view I am afraid, I think Corbyn saw (even hoped) that it would be close run, and, would bring Cameron down, giving him a chance to ride to the rescue.

Also Corbyn was very against the EU laws stopping Governments subsidising industries (unfair competition).

 

[briantrumpet]

Also Corbyn was very against the EU laws stopping Governments subsidising industries (unfair competition).

Hence my snarky comment about 'socialist utopia'. Just like Michael Foot invoked the 'sovereignty' mantra in the 1970s, against Heath's EEC enthusiasm. Maybe ironic that the left invoked 'sovereignty' because they thought the EEC was too restrictive on socialism, and the right invoked it because they thought it was too restrictive on free trade.

 

[Ian H]

Hence my snarky comment about 'socialist utopia'. Just like Michael Foot invoked the 'sovereignty' mantra in the 1970s, against Heath's EEC enthusiasm. Maybe ironic that the left invoked 'sovereignty' because they thought the EEC was too restrictive on socialism, and the right invoked it because they thought it was too restrictive on free trade.

The EU's neo-liberal economic rules are one of the most cogent reasons against membership. Though, had we been a more constructive member, we could perhaps have allied with the French to moderate the rules.

 

[briantrumpet]

allied with the French

 

[Pblakeney]

The EU's neo-liberal economic rules are one of the most cogent reasons against membership. Though, had we been a more constructive member, we could perhaps have allied with the French to moderate the rules.

I'm not sure you have grasped the Brexiteer's opinion of the French.
To save you the bother, it was defined at Agincourt and prevails.

 

[Ian H]

I'm not sure you have grasped the Brexiteer's opinion of the French.
To save you the bother, it was defined at Agincourt and prevails.

My comment referred to remaining.