Food banks: A first hand experience.

[Craig the cyclist]

My bold is where they'd politely ask me to leave. The only similarity is that it's computer software.

If you want the job, do the free online courses, then you have some experience and negotiate further development from there.

As someone who regularly employs people, I can tell you that a candidate who comes with a development need, and with a potential solution, is a very attractive proposition. It shows me they are not trying to blag it, are focused and keen to progress.

I know you will take offence, but it is a risk I am willing to take! You are sounding a little bit like someone who doesn't want a job. You have only put up barriers followed by reasons why you won't get the job, and not come up with one single positive reason why anyone should employ you. How do you think that will come across to an interviewer?

Instead of telling us what you can't do, tell us what you can do and build it from there.

 

[AndyRM]

If you want the job, do the free online courses, then you have some experience and negotiate further development from there.

As someone who regularly employs people, I can tell you that a candidate who comes with a development need, and with a potential solution, is a very attractive proposition. It shows me they are not trying to blag it, are focused and keen to progress.

I know you will take offence, but it is a risk I am willing to take! You are sounding a little bit like someone who doesn't want a job. You have only put up barriers followed by reasons why you won't get the job, and not come up with one single positive reason why anyone should employ you. How do you think that will come across to an interviewer?

Instead of telling us what you can't do, tell us what you can do and build it from there.

Why would I take offence?

OK, let's take this seriously.

"Yeah, I'd like the job, however, I can't use Unity or Unreal. I'd be interested in learning them, but you're looking at a good couple of years to get me to the level that I'm at with the graphic design side of things. So your decision as I see it is this: hire me as a designer, also hire a 3D developer and have us work alongside each other as a team."

 

[Craig the cyclist]

"Yeah, I'd like the job, however, I can't use Unity or Unreal. I'd be interested in learning them, but you're looking at a good couple of years to get me to the level that I'm at with the graphic design side of things. So your decision as I see it is this: hire me as a designer, also hire a 3D developer and have us work alongside each other as a team."

Again, you have begun by telling me, the interviewer, what it is you can't do. Tell me what you can do, or why you could easily do the thing you can't do, like this.........

"Yeah, I'd like the job, although my knowledge of Unity or Unreal is not as strong as I would like it to be I have already completed their online learning in my own time. With a small investment from you, which I am happy to match in taking the time as I see this is a great opportunity for my development within your company, I will be as strong in Unity as I am in graphic design, examples of which I have brought here {hand over printed examples}, more of which you can see at {insert previous companies name} website. In fact I did most of the work on their {insert product} using {insert software you used}"

You haven't lied, you haven't told them you can do something you can't, you have simply taken the opportunity to highlight again how good you are, how keen you are, and explained how you would love the opportunity to work for them.

 

[BoldonLad]

If you want the job, do the free online courses, then you have some experience and negotiate further development from there.

As someone who regularly employs people, I can tell you that a candidate who comes with a development need, and with a potential solution, is a very attractive proposition. It shows me they are not trying to blag it, are focused and keen to progress.

I know you will take offence, but it is a risk I am willing to take! You are sounding a little bit like someone who doesn't want a job. You have only put up barriers followed by reasons why you won't get the job, and not come up with one single positive reason why anyone should employ you. How do you think that will come across to an interviewer?

Instead of telling us what you can't do, tell us what you can do and build it from there.

Agree 100%, based on my experience as both a Manager, when staff recruitment was part of the remit, and, a Contractor, when finding work was a necessity.

I did post earlier on this subject, like you, I did not advocate telling lies, but, showing yourself as enthusiastic, willing to learn etc, does no harm. Like many things in life, it is not black and white, just because you "push the envelope" does not mean that you have to over extend yourself (IMHO).

PS. I also think you are wasting your breath (or, typing), not specifically on the OP, I hasten to add

 

[Ian H]

A previous manager of mine proudly told me he was proud to have dropped out of design school. He didn't have a f*cking clue, but the problem was people in marketing were totally taken in by him...

"Andy, can you provide this hi-res with 3mm bleed, all crops and in CMYK?"

"Nope. It's a web page."

"But XXX said..."

Slightly off-topic: A customer wanted labels for his cider bottles and brought in a pencil drawing, on feint-ruled notepaper, of his requirements. My designer mocked up a couple of ideas and he chose one. We ran the job, invoiced him including artwork. He complained that he'd supplied the artwork.

 

[AndyRM]

Again, you have begun by telling me, the interviewer, what it is you can't do. Tell me what you can do, or why you could easily do the thing you can't do, like this.........

"Yeah, I'd like the job, although my knowledge of Unity or Unreal is not as strong as I would like it to be I have already completed their online learning in my own time. With a small investment from you, which I am happy to match in taking the time as I see this is a great opportunity for my development within your company, I will be as strong in Unity as I am in graphic design, examples of which I have brought here {hand over printed examples}, more of which you can see at {insert previous companies name} website. In fact I did most of the work on their {insert product} using {insert software you used}"

You haven't lied, you haven't told them you can do something you can't, you have simply taken the opportunity to highlight again how good you are, how keen you are, and explained how you would love the opportunity to work for them.

That's your approach, which is fine. It would not be mine.

 

[AndyRM]

Slightly off-topic: A customer wanted labels for his cider bottles and brought in a pencil drawing, on feint-ruled notepaper, of his requirements. My designer mocked up a couple of ideas and he chose one. We ran the job, invoiced him including artwork. He complained that he'd supplied the artwork.

Had that happen a couple of times when I worked at a small studio. We had one customer so adamant he'd supplied artwork we ran the job with what he'd drawn. Predictably it looked sh!te so he ended up paying for artwork and two runs. Buffoon.

 

[All uphill]

Agree 100%, based on my experience as both a Manager, when staff recruitment was part of the remit, and, a Contractor, when finding work was a necessity.

I did post earlier on this subject, like you, I did not advocate telling lies, but, showing yourself as enthusiastic, willing to learn etc, does no harm. Like many things in life, it is not black and white, just because you "push the envelope" does not mean that you have to over extend yourself (IMHO).

PS. I also think you are wasting your breath (or, typing), not specifically on the OP, I hasten to add

Agreed.

I've done lots of recruiting and liked people who came with an honest solution to the problem I had ( work needing to be done, and no person to do it).

I wouldn't employ someone who was focused on what they couldn't do - that would just give me another problem to go with the original one.

I genuinely hope it helps to see it from an employer's viewpoint.

 

[Craig the cyclist]

That's your approach, which is fine. It would not be mine.

I think we are getting the picture that your approach is to sign on, get your benefits, moan about no-suitable jobs being given to you, moan that the jobs you could do want you to answer silly questions, then going to an interview and being as clear as you possibly can be that you can't do the job, before going back to sign-on again and get your benefits.

At some point you have to break this cycle. I wish you luck with that. If you want any help, then feel free to message me.

 

[AndyRM]

I think we are getting the picture that your approach is to sign on, get your benefits, moan about no-suitable jobs being given to you, moan that the jobs you could do want you to answer silly questions, then going to an interview and being as clear as you possibly can be that you can't do the job, before going back to sign-on again and get your benefits.

At some point you have to break this cycle. I wish you luck with that. If you want any help, then feel free to message me.

That's quite an impression, hot take.

My position isn't unreasonable, you think it is, and seem to be happy to consider me a layabout which is pretty far from the truth.

I've got a stage one interview on Monday as it happens, for a job I'm actually qualified to do and has appropriate development opportunities. I'll let you know how I get on!

PS - the terminology you, and others, use around Universal Credit shows just how touch you are...

 

[BoldonLad]

That's quite an impression, hot take.

My position isn't unreasonable, you think it is, and seem to be happy to consider me a layabout which is pretty far from the truth.

I've got a stage one interview on Monday as it happens, for a job I'm actually qualified to do and has appropriate development opportunities. I'll let you know how I get on!

PS - the terminology you, and others, use around Universal Credit shows just how touch you are...

Very best of luck! Look forward to hearing a positive outcome

 

[Craig the cyclist]

My position isn't unreasonable, you think it is,

I am just saying aim higher. If you apply for jobs that won't stretch you, you will never develop.

I've got a stage one interview on Monday as it happens, for a job I'm actually qualified to do and has appropriate development opportunities. I'll let you know how I get on!

Well, good luck, let us know how you get on 👍

 

[BoldonLad]

That's quite an impression, hot take.

My position isn't unreasonable, you think it is, and seem to be happy to consider me a layabout which is pretty far from the truth.

I've got a stage one interview on Monday as it happens, for a job I'm actually qualified to do and has appropriate development opportunities. I'll let you know how I get on!

PS - the terminology you, and others, use around Universal Credit shows just how touch you are...

Any (good) news on interview Andy?

 

[AndyRM]

Any (good) news on interview Andy?

It was more an informal chat with a view to getting a formal first interview. But I think it went well, made the interviewer laugh, she wasn't violently ill at the sight of me, managed not to swear... Also mentioned a few things they were after which weren't on the job spec, which is usually a good thing.

Just a matter of waiting now, she did say that she was away at road shows quite a bit, so it may be the end of the week/next week before I hear anything.

 

[AndyRM]

This is welcome news too:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-63543805

Fortunately, having gone through the rigmarole of ensuring I was eligible for the initial payment, I don't have to repeat the process. And, hopefully, all will go through as planned and I'll be back on a level-ish playing field!