Gender again. Sorry!

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icowden

Legendary Member
"Craze".
Genuine lol at that one.
Why. There has been a sudden huge increase in the number of autistic girls accessing services. Some of this may be increased knowledge, but some of it may also be a desire to fit in with a certain group of people. Calling it a craze is not that far fetched, and some experts think this may be due to influence by social media
 

monkers

Legendary Member
Why. There has been a sudden huge increase in the number of autistic girls accessing services. Some of this may be increased knowledge, but some of it may also be a desire to fit in with a certain group of people. Calling it a craze is not that far fetched, and some experts think this may be due to influence by social media

In your opinion what percentage of people is sufficient to define something as a 'craze'? How long does a 'craze' last before it fizzles to a number when it is no longer a craze?

If the internet connects people together so that some people who feel isolated feel more connected is that better or worse for their mental health?

Do those people caught up in this 'craze' enjoy better or worse overall mental health?
 
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icowden

Legendary Member
In your opinion what percentage of people is sufficient to define something as a 'craze'? How long does a 'craze' last before it fizzles to a number when it is no longer a craze?
If the internet connects people together so that some people who feel isolated feel more connected is that better or worse for their mental health?
Do those people caught up in this 'craze' enjoy better or worse overall mental health?
Why do any of those things matter? What matters is that we ensure that irreversible life changing treatment is only available to those with sufficient maturity and who have had counselling etc. These treatments should be treatments of last resort, for people who cannot otherwise balance their mental health. This is why concerns were raised about Tavistock in the first place.
 

monkers

Legendary Member
It mattered enough to you to comment on it. Now you are moving the goalposts, so I guess it isn't a craze at all, and the mental health of young people can be quickly glossed over at the time when other people are concerned about the declining mental health of the nation.

We already have a legal system for determination of sufficient maturity. Why is it deemed good enough for all issues but knowing one's own gender identity?
 

AndyRM

Elder Goth
Why. There has been a sudden huge increase in the number of autistic girls accessing services. Some of this may be increased knowledge, but some of it may also be a desire to fit in with a certain group of people. Calling it a craze is not that far fetched, and some experts think this may be due to influence by social media

Do you actually know how hard it is to be diagnosed with autism?

I doubt it.
 
We already have a legal system for determination of sufficient maturity. Why is it deemed good enough for all issues but knowing one's own gender identity?

Because the treatment for other mental health issues in children and adolescents doesn't usually include a pathway of medications for which the long term effects are unknown and the effects of which might be irreversible. Instead it usually includes exploratory therapy - which you dismiss as conversion therapy. All for a state of mental distress which resolves without medication or surgery in most children by adulthood.

It's not good enough because it is questionable whether children of 11 can give informed consent to a pathway of treatment that can leave them sterile and with no sexual function, ie puberty blockers. Which is why several countries have reviewed their protocols on using them with kids.
 
Do you actually know how hard it is to be diagnosed with autism?

I doubt it.

The children referred to the Tavistock had already been assessed for autistic traits. 35% of them were assessed as on the ASD. The rate for the general population is 2%. What's more likely ... that autistic children are being born with the 'wrong' gender or that they are getting fixated on something they think explains other issues?

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monkers

Legendary Member
Because the treatment for other mental health issues in children and adolescents doesn't usually include a pathway of medications for which the long term effects are unknown and the effects of which might be irreversible. Instead it usually includes exploratory therapy - which you dismiss as conversion therapy. All for a state of mental distress which resolves without medication or surgery in most children by adulthood.

It's not good enough because it is questionable whether children of 11 can give informed consent to a pathway of treatment that can leave them sterile and with no sexual function, ie puberty blockers. Which is why several countries have reviewed their protocols on using them with kids.

This view is because you can not accept that gender incongruence is not labelled by the WHO and other medical experts as a mental health disease. This is because you have no cognisance of your own self in relation to gender identity. Your assumption (you are spectacularly good at those) is that it therefore can not exist, but are firm in your vague belief that you are the 'normal' one, and people who are cognisant of their own gender identity are therefore diseased. Therefore the world must outlaw normality to allow you to fit in. Self-awareness must be contained as there is evidence that it may be spreading. For you it is a social contagion.

In the queer community, we've had a lot of experience of self-knowledge, and self-doubt caused by others telling us we are sick. Often those who shout the loudest are the ones firmly in the closet, in a deep state of denial. If that's you, then you are so far back in the closet, you're in farking Narnia.

Yes, young people have experienced confusion about their sexual identity, but increasingly incremental steps in some social acceptance brought gay people coming out in increasing numbers. The more social acceptance there is, the less people need to live in fear, and the greater the load on their resistance to mental health susceptibility.

What the culture wars that reactionaries like you promote is social exclusion in fear of cruel people like you who subject them to prejudice and persecution. This leads to increasing levels of anxiety and distress. Panic attacks become frequent, along with depression, tendencies for self-harm, suicide ideation, and the numbers of casualties of all of these things. The suffering is not restricted to those individuals, but to those who love them and care for them.

While you claim your cruelty is necessary for women's rights and your reliance on the argument that only a woman can bear a child, you completely manage to overlook the suffering of women who are faced with nurturing their children in the face of this societal cruelty that you advocate. You also manage to portray that men are the perpetrators of cruelty to women, while playing down the level of cruelty perpetrated by women on each other - almost as if in fact there is realisation that you are one of them.
 
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monkers

Legendary Member
Instead it usually includes exploratory therapy - which you dismiss as conversion therapy.

I have never said so.

But for once one of your hunches has paid off - because 'exploratory therapies' is a euphemism.

I am reminded; when Roger Helmer, a UKIP MEP and candidate for Newark was on the campaign trail, he had big posters stating his support for homeopathy. He was later embarrassed when it was pointed out that homeopathy is not a 'gay cure'. Newark is an interesting anagram, and we in the queer community awarded him Newark of the Year.
 
God, your posts are pompus and boring.

You need 'transgender children' to be a thing rather than kids having mental distress over their sexuality or gender non conformity because it validates adults. If children of 5 are saying they are trans it can't be a fetish can it? You've said yourself that not every 'transwoman' is genuinely trans. Funnily enough it's the sex offender ones you claim aren't.

You support putting kids on an irreversible medical pathway because they are gay or non conforming, or they have autistic traits or a myriad of other mental health issues going on .... all because it validates adult transwomen.

Where are all the middle aged women taking advantage of social acceprance and coming out as transmen? How odd that there are so many more 50 plus men who want to 'live as women' and adopt female stereotypes than there are 50 plus women suddenly realising their authentic self is a man.
 
This is typically the view of people who believe that conversion therapies should be available 'to help' trans children / young people so that parents can feel better about themselves.

You said as much here. Banning any therapy that explores body dysmorphia and doesn't automatically affirm a child as their new sex is what transactivists want. It's what Stonewall want. It's what you want, isn't it?

It will mean no therapist or psychologist can talk with kids about other issues that might have shed light on their unhappiness with their body. It cements affirmation only as the only route for mental health therapy for these children. This is a million miles away from gay conversion therapy but transactivists want it all lumped together and banned just the same.

As to parents, many of them are in huge distress having been fed the line 'Would you rather have a trans child or a dead child?'. Others, as Hannah Barnes' Tavistock book noted, were homophobic - they couldn't bear having a little boy who loved dolls and dresses. They'd rather have a straight daughter than a gay son.

You don't give a toss about these children. We know that from how dismissive you are of detransitioners. These children and their parents go through hell but to you they are just collateral damage that serves to validate adult men. This is a father on Twitter today:

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monkers

Legendary Member
God, your posts are pompus and boring.
I have a long record for excellence in this area, with that reputation to uphold. For the second time of asking please do not forget to also say that I'm both arrogant and superior.


You need 'transgender children' to be a thing rather than kids having mental distress over their sexuality or gender non conformity because it validates adults. If children of 5 are saying they are trans it can't be a fetish can it? You've said yourself that not every 'transwoman' is genuinely trans. Funnily enough it's the sex offender ones you claim aren't.

What's this? You think trans girls are faking it to avoid going to a women's prison for crimes yet to be committed?

Stephen Wood was considered by other prisoners as not trans but a fake. I think the timing of Wood's declaration of a trans identity makes that plausible.
 

monkers

Legendary Member
You said as much here. Banning any therapy that explores body dysmorphia and doesn't automatically affirm a child as their new sex is what transactivists want. It's what Stonewall want. It's what you want, isn't it?

This is you rejecting gender incongruence as a thing, attempting to reframe it as a mental health disease. This is your own cruelty that you can not recognise. Writing millions of words of self-justification for it doesn't dull my sense of who you are.
 
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