Gender again. Sorry!

[CXRAndy]

But we are not talking about men are we, we are talking about trans women, who are women.

No they're not women they're are males

 

[Pale Rider]

Are you that easily offended that a trans man in a male changing room changed there while you were there?

It has nothing to do with being offended.

I daresay the majority of men, which by definition includes the majority of men who call themselves women, could be trusted to behave if they had to change in a women's changing room.

But that is no reason or excuse to make the women uneasy, which is what most will be.

about trans women, who are women.

They are men purely on the 'looks like a duck and quacks like a duck' test.

If it could talk the duck could say 'I am a pigeon', but no one would believe it.

 

[Bromptonaut]

That is massively over complicating a simple question.

The answer being to let women have their own toilets and changing rooms.

They have them.

AIUI issue is blokes like you or me deciding they'd rather be Roberta or Simone. They dose up on hormones and grow boobs but cannot afford to have their cocks cut off turned inside out.

 

[CXRAndy]

They have them.

Not exclusively. This will revert soon to solely biological women.

 

[monkers]

You have just confirmed what just about every women wants is privacy/safety from men

No. Stop this manipulation.

I becoming increasingly concerned by this manipulation of people's words by idiots who think they are smart.

I am a little shy, but I am a pragmatist. If all that is available is a shared space, I am as happy to change with a trans woman as a cis woman.

 

[monkers]

No they're not women they're are males

Ok Aurora, that's your view, we've heard it in both your identities.

 

[Pale Rider]

They have them.

AIUI issue is blokes like you or me deciding they'd rather be Roberta or Simone. They dose up on hormones and grow boobs but cannot afford to have their cocks cut off turned inside out.

They don't have them if men, even if they've been drugged up and tinkered with a scapel, are allowed into those spaces.

By the way, I like the hint at personal information in your example.

I had a colleague who sometimes called me Roberta, not for any reason, it was just a tick he had which lasted for a while.

Didn't bother me much, but I was glad when he stopped doing it.

 

[Bromptonaut]

They are men purely on the 'looks like a duck and quacks like a duck' test.

If I could I'd introduce you to my one time colleague Heather.

 

[monkers]

They are men purely on the 'looks like a duck and quacks like a duck' test.

If it could talk the duck could say 'I am a pigeon', but no one would believe it.

I think you must be eating too strong a cheese for you to handle - don't have nightmares.

Reductio ad absurdum.

 

[AuroraSaab]

Dressed males are routinely in female toilets - cleaning them. Dressed women in men's too.

Yes, CRB checked with a sign outside saying 'Male cleaner at work'.

The position at the other end of the spectrum to the 'TERF' one regarding penises in the spaces where women are actually naked and potentially vulnerable is, I think, as follows:

1. You'd only see it at all if somebody was being immodest and not using a cubicle, curtain towel or gown;

Can you grasp that it is having a male there at all that is the issue, not necessarily how much of their body is on display?

1. That's once in a blue moon territory;

How often does it have to happen before it's a problem?

1. If its owner has been on hormones it's size/capacity are, see posts upthread, those of a child. Save clutching you pears for when it matters;

Again, erectile dysfunction does not make someone less male. Should all men with erectile dysfunction be allowed into women's spaces? If not, why not?

1. If its owner, or anyone else, is displaying any genitalia in a way that's threatening there are plenty of offences that might be charged.

It's enough that they are there. Women shouldn't have to wait until a man is masturbating or whatever before your threshold of discomfort is reached and they have a right to complain.

They have them.

AIUI issue is blokes like you or me deciding they'd rather be Roberta or Simone. They dose up on hormones and grow boobs but cannot afford to have their cocks cut off turned inside out.

No, it isn't. All men are equally male. Self ID makes it easier for dodgy men to enter women's spaces and services but the issue is bring male, not just their motivation. What is the difference between a male with a GRC, a male who has had surgery, a male on hormones, a male who can convincingly present as a woman, and every man on this forum? The answer is nothing. They are all equally male and that doesn't change regardless of how they dress, how they feel, or what piece of paper they have.

 

[monkers]

Yes, CRB checked with a sign outside saying 'Male cleaner at work'.

Can you grasp that it is having a male there at all that is the issue, not necessarily how much of their body is on display?

How often does it have to happen before it's a problem?

Again, erectile dysfunction does not make someone less male. Should all men with erectile dysfunction be allowed into women's spaces? If not, why not?


It's enough that they are there. Women shouldn't have to wait until a man is masturbating or whatever before your threshold of discomfort is reached and they have a right to complain.




No, it isn't. All men are equally male. Self ID makes it easier for dodgy men to enter women's spaces and services but the issue is bring male, not just their motivation. What is the difference between a male with a GRC, a male who has had surgery, a male on hormones, a male who can convincingly present as a woman, and every man on this forum? The answer is nothing. They are all equally male and that doesn't change regardless of how they dress, how they feel, or what piece of paper they have.

Yes, we heard you Andy.

 

[CXRAndy]

No. Stop this manipulation.

I becoming increasingly concerned by this manipulation of people's words by idiots who think they are smart.

I am a little shy, but I am a pragmatist. If all that is available is a shared space, I am as happy to change with a trans woman as a cis woman.

You further confirmed that you are shy.

Just about every woman is exactly the same. They don't like other women seeing them let alone men.

You've completely undermined your own argument

 

[monkers]

You further confirmed that you are shy.

Just about every woman is exactly the same. They don't like other women seeing them let alone men.

You've completely undermined your own argument

No. You've failed to grasp the essence of simple sentences. Not that I expected anything else.

 

[AuroraSaab]

If I could I'd introduce you to my one time colleague Heather.

Can you understand that whilst you might regard your colleague as a woman, others, including women, might very much regard them as 100% male? You are assuming that others should share your perception.

 

[CXRAndy]

It's obvious you've have crashed your own position