Gender again. Sorry!

[monkers]

Is the best you can do to say that you are a woman because of a piece of paper or a stereotype? Because that seems rather insulting.


No it didn't as the EHRC have made clear. Transwomen can be excluded for being male when appropriate.



I think men should be excluded from women's single sex services and sports when appropriate. It's OK that groups have stuff for themselves when appropriate, whether based on being gay, male, female, disabled, religious or race, including specialised services for trans people too. How entitled of you to think that they shouldn't be allowed to.

One function of the EHRC is to give guidance on the law. The law says that trans women with a GRC are legally female.

Finally you see why they are not fit for purpose or otherwise why you are chatting nonsense (again).

 

[AuroraSaab]

We all know you think Biology and a billion years of evolution is transphobic bigotry, thanks.

 

[monkers]

We all know you think Biology and a billion years of evolution is transphobic bigotry, thanks.

Both cis women and trans women have biology, so that word does nothing to say that trans women are not women. Biology is the study of all living things, not just cis women. The brain is 'biological' yet you dismiss it's role as not important to being a woman.

 

[AuroraSaab]

It's the whole science behind Biology not the word itself, as you know.

What is it that both I and Eddie Izzard share that makes us both women? And that say, Tom Cruise, doesn't share, that makes him not a woman whilst Eddie is one?

(And before you have an attack of the vapours Eddie doesn't mind being called Eddie).

 

[monkers]

It's the whole science behind Biology not the word itself, as you know.

What is it that both I and Eddie Izzard share that makes us both women? And that say, Tom Cruise, doesn't share, that makes him not a woman whilst Eddie is one?

(And before you have an attack of the vapours Eddie doesn't mind being called Eddie).

Neither biology or anatomy are the words you need, despite their repeated use. If you say you want to follow the science, then you must follow the language of science.

If you want to say what makes you and Eddie Izzard different, but want to follow the science, then you can say, that you are a homological female person, and Suzy Izzard is a homological male person. Where you are the similar is that you share some protected human rights as we all do.

And I think I know where some people are going to go with this ...

 

[Deleted member 159]

Yes these are all the common traits of what it is to be a woman. I've not had baby or a hysterectomy. I don't menstruate. I am a possibly a mammal though. Perhaps I'm duck-billed platypus.

Think you're commonly known as
Dried up old prune

 

[monkers]

Think you're commonly known as
Dried up old prune

Did you manage to think of that all by yourself? Well done. Good work.

(The irony is that an obvious MCP is saying he is here to defend women.)

 

[monkers]

It's the whole science behind Biology not the word itself, as you know.

What is it that both I and Eddie Izzard share that makes us both women? And that say, Tom Cruise, doesn't share, that makes him not a woman whilst Eddie is one?

(And before you have an attack of the vapours Eddie doesn't mind being called Eddie).

Why the objection to using the correct word 'homology'?

Eddie prefers to be called Suzy but being a long-standing public figure appreciates that 'Eddie Izzard' is a brand.

Also it is because Eddie/ Suzy whichever does not identify as a trans woman, but a genderfluid person with a preference for female pronouns.

 

[AuroraSaab]

Why the objection to using the correct word 'homology'?

Because women's oppression is sex based. It's oppression very much based on them not being the same as men. When we get to a situation where women aren't oppressed on the basis of their sex then you can quite happily call yourself woman, man, or whatever, despite your biology, because it won't matter.

Saying 'We're all human beings' doesn't explain what Eddie Izzard shares with me that makes us both women, which is what you claim.

What is it that Eddie and I share that puts us both in the category Women, but which at the same time excludes other men?

 

[Bromptonaut]

Is the best you can do to say that you are a woman because of a piece of paper or a stereotype? Because that seems rather insulting.

As I said, differing premises.

 

[monkers]

Because women's oppression is sex based.

Well now, that it's a biological scientist you need, but a behavioural scientist. It's the behaviour of one group oppressing another group that is the problem. The nature of the groups happens to be sex.

In reality you are aware of this, because you always speak of 'male' violence.

 

[monkers]

We all know you think Biology and a billion years of evolution is transphobic bigotry, thanks.

No. I think you bigotry about a designated minority based on your personal prejudices is transphobia. And you're welcome, no need to thank me.

 

[AuroraSaab]

As I said, differing premises.

Which is fair enough - though it's like a Christian saying they come to a debate about the existence of God from the position that God exists. An assertion of it is not in itself a valid argument for the existence of God.

Your differing premise wouldn't matter if accepting it didn't entail important and detrimental consequences for women and girls. But it does, so your 'I come at it from a different premise' and a 'birth certificate makes you a woman' is a bit lame quite honestly.

 

[AuroraSaab]

Well now, that it's a biological scientist you need, but a behavioural scientist. It's the behaviour of one group oppressing another group that is the problem. The nature of the groups happens to be sex.

And what differentiates the 2 groups is sex, not gender identity. Girls and women don't escape that oppression by saying they aren't women anymore. It doesn't just 'happen' to be sex that differentiates the 2 groups. It's not a coincidence that men comit 95% plus of sex crimes and that the victims are mostly female.

No. I think you bigotry about a designated minority based on your personal prejudices is transphobia. And you're welcome, no need to thank me.

Men are 50% of the population. They aren't a minority.

 

[monkers]

Which is fair enough - though it's like a Christian saying they come to a debate about the existence of God from the position that God exists. An assertion of it is not in itself a valid argument for the existence of God.

Your differing premise wouldn't matter if accepting it didn't entail important and detrimental consequences for women and girls. But it does, so your 'I come at it from a different premise' and a 'birth certificate makes you a woman' is a bit lame quite honestly.

The differing premises being Bromptonauts facts versus your opinions - of course you see that as lame.