Gender again. Sorry!

[AuroraSaab]

It's difficult for me to know what it feels like not to have a gender identity as like most people I have a strong sense of mine.

Aka "It's difficult for me to know what it feels like not to be a Christian as I have a strong sense of being one". Good for you. It's still a metaphysical belief and calling people who don't subscribe to your belief system an x,y,or z gender is imposing your belief on them.

Saying you are 'cisgender' and I'm the 'other' is like saying you're a unicorn and I'm a minotaur. It's all made up bs. It must be exhausting being you, endlessly contriving all this stuff to convince yourself that someone born male can be a woman.

 

[classic33]

Aka "It's difficult for me to know what it feels like not to be a Christian as I have a strong sense of being one". Good for you. It's still a metaphysical belief and calling people who don't subscribe to your belief system an x,y,or z gender is imposing your belief on them.

Saying you are 'cisgender' and I'm the 'other' is like saying you're a unicorn and I'm a minotaur. It's all made up bs. It must be exhausting being you, endlessly contriving all this stuff to convince yourself that someone born male can be a woman.

What about trans men. The other side of the argument which you ignore in your single minded pursuit of trans women only wanting access to women's single sex spaces for multiple reasons. All of which are dangerous to women.

 

[monkers]

Aka "It's difficult for me to know what it feels like not to be a Christian as I have a strong sense of being one". Good for you. It's still a metaphysical belief and calling people who don't subscribe to your belief system an x,y,or z gender is imposing your belief on them.

Saying you are 'cisgender' and I'm the 'other' is like saying you're a unicorn and I'm a minotaur. It's all made up bs. It must be exhausting being you, endlessly contriving all this stuff to convince yourself that someone born male can be a woman.

You must be the one that's exhausted endlessly dreaming up kinds of forms of words to justify what is, all said and done, just bigotry beneath a veneer of claimed respectability.

Is 'love' a metaphysical belief too? Or is that 'biology'. Just that I very much love my partner, but there's no trace of that in my DNA AFAIA. Maybe we should ban love too?

 

[AuroraSaab]

What about trans men. The other side of the argument which you ignore in your single minded pursuit of trans women only wanting access to women's single sex spaces for multiple reasons. All of which are dangerous to women.

Sounds like we agree. I don't ignore transmen. They don't present much of a safety risk to males in male single sex spaces though do they? I think men deserve their own spaces just like women but it's up to men whether they choose to grant transmen access to them.

Maybe we should ban love too?

Who someone loves or doesn't love doesn't impinge on anybody else. This is the bonkers false equivalence that you're reduced to.

 

[monkers]

Sounds like we agree. I don't ignore transmen. They don't present much of a safety risk to males in male single sex spaces though do they? I think men deserve their own spaces just like women but it's up to men whether they choose to grant transmen access to them.


Who someone loves or doesn't love doesn't impinge on anybody else. This is the bonkers false equivalence that you're reduced to.

But love - it's not biology, it's just in our heads, like our gender identity awareness. How can we simply dismiss one as nonsense and not the other?

And what about self-love? Is that biology or metaphysical? I feel sure you are massively qualified to give me an expert opinion.

 

[multitool]

Aurora will be along in a moment to tell us that homosexuality is fantasy because its "just in our heads", and goes against biological Reproductive function of sex.

 

[AuroraSaab]

Because nobody is seeking to impose love on anybody else, whereas you seek to impose your belief in gender identity on others when you say 'You identify/don't identify as x, y,z' or 'You are cis'.

A closer equivalent would be you telling someone 'You are in love with xxxx', even when they tell you they aren't. But again, here you are, trying pass off something like love that really only affects those involved as being the same as something that has wider implications and detrimental effects on others.

Aurora will be along in a moment to tell us that homosexuality is fantasy because its "just in our heads", and goes against biological Reproductive function of sex.

On the contrary. If you say men can be women and can be lesbians it's you who are denying same sex attraction is real.

 

[multitool]

No it isn't.

Try again.

 

[icowden]

What about trans men. The other side of the argument which you ignore in your single minded pursuit of trans women only wanting access to women's single sex spaces for multiple reasons. All of which are dangerous to women.

I'll be honest. In a fight or attack between a transman and a man, my money is on the biological man every time.

 

[monkers]

Because nobody is seeking to impose love on anybody else, whereas you seek to impose your belief in gender identity on others when you say 'You identify/don't identify as x, y,z' or 'You are cis'.

A closer equivalent would be you telling someone 'You are in love with xxxx', even when they tell you they aren't. But again, here you are, trying pass off something like love that really only affects those involved as being the same as something that has wider implications and detrimental effects on others.



On the contrary. If you say men can be women and can be lesbians it's you who are denying same sex attraction is real.

Nobody is imposing their gender identity on you. Not the cisgender or transgender communities. You are free to be agender, but you are trying to force this upon everyone else. Being agender is your own self-knowledge, don't let anyone try to change you. But don't you dare feel empowered to tell others that they must change to fit in with your own agender world view.

 

[monkers]

2021 Census result on the question of gender identity.

What were the results on gender identity?​

Around 94.0% of respondents aged 16 or over answered the question on gender identity.

93.5% of respondents said their gender identity and their sex registered at birth were the same. Around 262,000 people (0.5%) said their gender identity and sex registered at birth were different.

Most people identify as cisgender. I identify as cisgender. N identifies as cisgender (with a trans history). You identify as agender fruitloops, but 93.5% of the population say they do not*.

*or rather 93.5% of the 94% who responded do not.

 

[AuroraSaab]

No it isn't. Try again.

So two biological males in a sexual relationship immediately become lesbians at the moment they declare themselves trans? Or one decides they're trans so the other guy is now a heterosexual man not a gay man? Or have they always been lesbians, they just didn't realise?

More seriously, you can only feel sorry for the middle aged and elderly women whose husbands come out as trans. After a 40 year marriage they're now in a lesbian relationship according to you.

 

[AuroraSaab]

Nobody is imposing their gender identity on you. Not the cisgender or transgender communities. You are free to be agender, but you are trying to force this upon everyone else. Being agender is your own self-knowledge, don't let anyone try to change you. But don't you dare feel empowered to tell others that they must change to fit in with your own agender world view.

When you call people cis or agender, or any of the other 200 genders, you have already imposed your belief in gender identity on them. You clearly feel empowered to impose that on people so perhaps you should address your own entitlement first.

 

[monkers]

So two biological males in a sexual relationship immediately become lesbians at the moment they declare themselves trans? Or one decides they're trans so the other guy is now a heterosexual man not a gay man? Or have they always been lesbians, they just didn't realise?

More seriously, you can only feel sorry for the middle aged and elderly women whose husbands come out as trans. After a 40 year marriage they're now in a lesbian relationship according to you.

Lesbian means of or pertaining to the island of Lesbos. I've never been to Lesbos. Although I'm gay, I'm not always happy and never brightly coloured. I've always preferred women.

Language is dynamic, if you try to standstill you just end up looking Stonehenge.

 

[monkers]

When you call people cis or agender, or any of the other 200 genders, you have already imposed your belief in gender identity on them. You clearly feel empowered to impose that on people so perhaps you should address your own entitlement first.

So nearly everyone in the Census was able to declare their gender identity. You say you don't have one, that's fine, but that is what 'agender' means. If you renounce that word too, who or what are you, one of those unicorns that you were banging on about earlier?