Gender again. Sorry!

[icowden]

The GCs will start with this idiotic notion of "women being erased" at the mere whisper of a very specific use in a specific context for a specific reason of something other than the word 'wonan'.

Isn't that what Jonathan Ross calls the chap from Boyzone?

Joking aside, you could just as well argue that the activist end of the Trans lobby will immediately jump on anyone whispering about women being erased and threaten them with rape and/or death.

Neither of these things is helpful.

 

[classic33]

Isn't that what Jonathan Ross calls the chap from Boyzone?

Joking aside, you could just as well argue that the activist end of the Trans lobby will immediately jump on anyone whispering about women being erased and threaten them with rape and/or death.

Neither of these things is helpful.

Or being told that if you don't agree with the person, you're for everything they are against.

Holding an opinion on here is something that can only be done by some. Others are, and have been, simply dismissed as not relevant. If you want a discussion on anything, you have to be willing to consider the points raised by others. This means you don't simply accuse others of being for a particular course of action, because their views differ from yours.

 

[multitool]

Are you suggesting that like so many men before him, he was brought down by a woman?

I don't think I need to suggest anything. It's just yet another person who has left because of Aurora's behaviour.

 

[multitool]

Joking aside, you could just as well argue that the activist end of the Trans lobby will immediately jump on anyone whispering about women being erased and threaten them with rape and/or death.

Neither of these things is helpful.

Extremists are, by definition, extreme. I agree, none of this is particularly savoury and you won't find me endorsing any of it.

Having said that, I view both sides as having different motivations. The Terf side is intent on oppressing trans women and making their lives impossible. The trans activists are intent on stopping this.

I know where my sympathies lie, primarily because the Terf side are generating a moral panic about something that isn't, in general, a real problem (yes, I accept that tw in sports needs to be worked through...but it's very much on the fringe.) The Terf side are happily co-opting actual fascists.

The mere fact that this is happening ought to cause them to stop and reflect, but they don't. Because its an obsessive cult.

 

[CXRAndy]

The Terf side is intent on oppressing trans women and making their lives impossible.

Not far as I'm concerned.

They can live their adult lives however they like, until they infringed upon women's way of life.

 

[multitool]

Not far as I'm concerned.

They can live their adult lives however they like, until they infringed upon women's way of life.

Your genuine concern for women is so touching

 

[AndyRM]

Not far as I'm concerned.

They can live their adult lives however they like, until they infringed upon women's way of life.

This doesn't make sense.

You don't think TERFs have the aim on making trans people's lives impossible, yet they are free to live their lives however they like? That simply isn't doable if the extreme version of TERF rhetoric is put into practise.

Given your past comments and what you share from totally one sided sources about trans people on this thread it's pretty difficult to believe you have any kind of support for them whatsoever.

And this is part of the problem, for me anyway. Because we're in a media scape which is only interested in the extreme views on either side, rational discussions (in public at least) are seemingly impossible.

There's a middle ground out there I believe, but getting there is the challenge. Slogans like "Punch a TERF" aren't meant to be taken any more literally than "Eat the rich" but have been hijacked to make trans activists look like violent nutters.

 

[CXRAndy]

Your genuine concern for women is so touching

I value the women in my life, and wouldn't want anything to undermine their position

This doesn't make sense

Off course it does, trans not only want to be themselves, they also want others (mainly women) to conform to their beliefs by allowing access into women's circles.

It's validation by bullying.

If they want validation for chopping of bits of their body, taking powerful drugs, so be it, don't expect others to go along with it.

I did say I would take the piss long while back, because that's how I see the situation, it's comedic.

 

[multitool]

I value the women in my life, and wouldn't want anything to undermine their position

I'm almost certain that you or any of the women in your life haven't even seen a trans woman. Let alone been "undermined" by one.

 

[AndyRM]

I value the women in my life, and wouldn't want anything to undermine their position


Off course it does, trans not only want to be themselves, they also want others (mainly women) to conform to their beliefs by allowing access into women's circles.

It's validation by bullying.

If they want validation for chopping of bits of their body, taking powerful drugs, so be it, don't expect others to go along with it.

I did say I would take the piss long while back, because that's how I see the situation, it's comedic.

Women's circles? Like knitting or baking? Perhaps something more sinister like a coven?

Is your life so devoid of actual comedy that this is where you come for a giggle?

 

[CXRAndy]

Women's circles? Like knitting or baking? Perhaps something more sinister like a coven?

Is your life so devoid of actual comedy that this is where you come for a giggle?

You see you belittle women's position in life. They have fought hard over many decades to achieve what they wanted, not to be told over the last number of years to move over for men again.


I see most things in life with a smile.

 

[multitool]

You see you belittle women's position in life. They have fought hard over many decades to achieve what they wanted, not to be told over the last number of years to move over for men again.

That's weird.

I stand corrected. Never realised you are a feminist. Everything you've ever said made you look like a bigot.

 

[AndyRM]

You see you belittle women's position in life. They have fought hard over many decades to achieve what they wanted, not to be told over the last number of years to move over for men again.


I see most things in life with a smile.

You're the one who said "women's circles" which is so laughably antiquated I figured I'd respond in kind.

I don't dispute that women's rights have been hard fought, and it's an ongoing battle. Despite what you seem to believe, similar battles has been going on in the LGBTQIA+ community for a very long time too.

It's a topic which has reared it's head only relatively recently, which is why it isn't being properly considered, and so much conversation and legislation gets sidetracked by hysteria.

 

[AuroraSaab]

You don't think TERFs have the aim on making trans people's lives impossible, yet they are free to live their lives however they like? That simply isn't doable if the extreme version of TERF rhetoric is put into practise.

You can't seriously think that the aim of gender critical feminists is to make trans people's lives impossible? Nobody cared how people lived their lives until there was a push into women's single sex spaces and a push to medicalise children.

Slogans like "Punch a TERF" aren't meant to be taken any more literally than "Eat the rich" but have been hijacked to make trans activists look like violent nutters.

They do a pretty good job of that on their own. Imagine if women walked round with 'Kill Trans' on a t shirt. It wouldn't be dismissed so easily.

Can you find me an example of a trans meeting where gender critical women have tried to stop it taking place? Or assaulted someone there? Or made signs that say 'Decapitate Trans'? Aggression and calls for violence is an absolute mainstay of modern transactivism. It's not a few isolated nutters.

 

[AndyRM]

You can't seriously think that the aim of gender critical feminists is to make trans people's lives impossible? Nobody cared how people lived their lives until there was a push into women's single sex spaces and a push to medicalise children.



They do a pretty good job of that on their own. Can you find me an example of a trans meeting where gender critical women have tried to stop it taking place? Or assaulted someone there? Or made signs that say 'Decapitate Trans'?

Aggression and calls for violence is an absolute mainstay of modern transactivism. It's not a few isolated nutters.

Impossible was a bit extreme language wise. Challenging maybe?

As for the protest thing, yeah, I probably could. But it would be as isolated the examples you brought up. Generally the shots I've seen of the "Decapitate TERFs" etc are the same few all the time.

You can find good and bad examples of protesting on all sides, it's not just limited to transactivism.