How or Why is an Octopus toy Considered Antisemitic

[winjim]

I do get your point - I think! - but for me, the sincerity of the "offended" party went out of the window when they refused to accept Greta's apology/correction. It then became a totally disporportiionate response - especially aimed at a very young woman, with KNOWN mental disability, who is VERY unlikely to know about the octopus-evil-jews connection.

Slight pedantic correction in that autism is considered a neurodevelopmental condition rather than a mental disability. But yeah, do we really think the likes of Ian Miles Cheong et al are genuinely concerned about antisemitism? They're not, they're extreme right wingers who will exploit any opportunity to attack what they perceive to be progressive politics. And I'd be willing to bet that many if not most of them didn't know know about the association between the octopus and antisemitism. I certainly didn't until the recent Martin Rawson controversy.

 

[AuroraSaab]

Do you know anyone who is triggered by either of those things? Cos I wouldn't want people to think you were being disingenuous by saying 'is triggered by' when you mean 'has an opinion about'.

Both flags/nationalism and statues have been considered significant enough to have their own threads on here. A flag on the Labour membership card seemed to spark opinion. How would you differentiate between opinion and being triggered by? The union flag on a party card seemed to be considered a hidden dog whistle for nationalism the other day, whereas people seeing antisemitic allusions (accidental or not) seem to be being told those associations aren't meaningful anymore.

 

[Ian H]

...people seeing antisemitic allusions (accidental or not) seem to being told those associations aren't meaningful anymore.

They are not being told that.

 

[AuroraSaab]

Several posters have said that it's used by others, many have joked about it. Suggesting it's such common imagery does seem to me to be denying the long established association between the imagery and antisemitism. Again, I think if we were talking about other groups and certain imagery/symbolism we wouldn't be questioning the association.

 

[Ian H]

Several posters have said that it's used by others, many have joked about it. Suggesting it's such common imagery does seem to me to be denying the long established association between the imagery and antisemitism. Again, I think if we were talking about other groups and certain imagery/symbolism we wouldn't be questioning the association.

Used by the Israeli government. People have joked about a small cuddly toy that barely resembles an octopus. What point are you trying to invent?

 

[theclaud]

Both flags/nationalism and statues have been considered significant enough to have their own threads on here. A flag on the Labour membership card seemed to spark opinion. How would you differentiate between opinion and being triggered by? The union flag on a party card seemed to be considered a hidden dog whistle for nationalism the other day, whereas people seeing antisemitic allusions (accidental or not) seem to be being told those associations aren't meaningful anymore.

Participating in (or starting) a thread about something does not equate to "being triggered". Why is it a problem for you if something "sparks opinion"? And do I have to mention the C Word again? There seems limited point in trying to have a conversation with someone who will not entertain a good faith discussion about the ways in which things are alike, and the ways in which they are not alike.

 

[AuroraSaab]

My point is that having an opinion about flags and nationalism or statues is considered a meaningful discussion but people having an opinion about antisemitic imagery is dismissed and minimised.

I have no idea what the C word is. Knowing you it's probably Corbyn. The only man in the world to whom guilt by association is never allowed to apply.

 

[winjim]

My point is that people on here having an opinion about flags and nationalism or statues is not dismissed in the way that people having an opinion about antisemitic imagery is.

Please stop making things up.

I think Thunberg acted with integrity and consideration in her apology and subsequent reframing of the photograph and many older and supposedly wiser people could learn from her handling of the situation.

 

[Fab Foodie]

I think it's fair to say that people that have survived/endured various debates here, come from (for want of a better word) a more 'enlightened' or deeper and more nuanced political, social and world view. Some of us are trying to catch-up. It's not unreasonable that the majority of people shown the Greta photo would not see a stuffed Octopus as any kind of trope or have any view about about it being a disability aid. When one part of the biased media picks this up and uses it for political gain, the sheeple are putty in their hands (because very few would actually take the time to look into it). The loudest voice becomes 'the truth'.
Thankfully I have you lot to set-out the arguments, because the Octopus as trope and as Greta's disability support would never have even entered my head. Every day's a school day.....

 

[Fab Foodie]

It ain't pedantry if it illuminates.

Wot, like this you mean?

 

[fozy tornip]

"Tentacles"

View attachment 4822

A foreskin excised with a pastry cutter, surely?
An obviously racist allusion to the Jewish practice of MGM.

 

[Moodyman]

A foreskin excised with a pastry cutter, surely?
An obviously racist allusion to the Jewish practice of MGM.

But, that could equally apply to Muslims as they also MGM. See, now you’re an Islamophobe.

But, as many Muslims are Arab, and Arabs are also Semitic peoples, you are in effect, anti-Semitic. 😵‍💫

Just proves that if one wants to get offended or use it to silence legitimate criticism, one will find a tenuous link.

 

[Ian H]

But, that could equally apply to Muslims as they also MGM. See, now you’re an Islamophobe.

Is it still routine in the US of A?

 

[Unkraut]

She's just a human being expressing concern for other human beings.

The problem is her concern seems to be rather selective. Wanting justice for all in the face of Hamas atrocities is weak to say the least. The YT clip posted by @dutchguylivingintheuk was ironic to say the least.

Are you telling me you categorise all staff in the petroleum industry as EVIL?

The actions of anyone that knowingly will long term lead to the harm of others would indeed be evil. Greta would not have been wrong imo to use that expression.

Isn't it amazing how Greta gets under the skin of so many people?

It took some guts to get up in front of the UN to give her speech at her age. On the other hand 'you have stolen my dreams and childhood' seems to make the issue revolve around her. She had to add 'I am one of the lucky ones' to deflect to my mind the legitimate criticism from someone in the developing world that living in Sweden she is not so much lucky as privileged. It's true that she wasn't forced to make the speech but to have been filled with so much fear seems to me to be bordering on child abuse. That was my reaction at the time.

Some brief footage of her at Glasgow showed the adulation has gone to her head. Probably not that surprising.

From the point of view of climate alarmism she was a propaganda coup, and wrong-footed many a sceptic. This was shown in their failure to deal with her, frequent ad hominum attacks, and on the comment sections of some sceptic sites appallingly viscious nasty comments. I found tbh some of it disgusting. They should have left her alone, seen she was a propaganda ploy, and dealt with the issues, but you are right she did touch a raw nerve.

I do think it is of concern that she is gaining power and influence without responsibility. It's easy to say don't carry on with business as usual, but how do you actually do that without wrecking the world economy.

 

[bobzmyunkle]

Wanting justice for all in the face of Hamas atrocities is weak to say the least

Not sure that's what was going on.
What are you proposing? An eye for an eye etc?

From the point of view of climate alarmism

Don't panic, you'll be ok if you're a true believer?