Rishi - be a Robin Hood, Tax the richer and give to the poorer....

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Unkraut

Master of the Inane Comment
Location
Germany
I am nothing
I keep warning about the perils of selective quotation ...
Return that tax direct to individuals in the form of a universal basic income, so no one is in in dire poverty. .
Sounds good at first, but gives the State complete power over the citizenry. Might be OK if the State is benign, but what if it isn't but gets taken over by control freaks with a social engineering agenda or either the right or the left?
Have a more graduated tax system with more tax brackets so everyone pays what they can.
This is frequently trotted out under the guise of 'fair' taxation, but at some point, if you exclude the hyper rich, it no longer becomes worthwhile to take risks with running a business or to 'improve yourself' by getting better qualified if ever increasing amounts of your money are taken by the State.

Well some mug had to go and say this. 🍺 ^_^ It's not actually far from reality, in the company I work for I've known of people promoted to more senior management positions who have given up the promotion because the higher tax bracket their extra salary put them in meant it wasn't worth the extra hassle. Big increase in stress, generous increase in gross pay, petty increase in net pay. It's known as 'cold progression' here.

Conversely it can pay to reduce to a 4 day week as a 20% drop in gross pay entails only a 9% drop in net pay.
 
I've known of people promoted to more senior management positions who have given up the promotion because the higher tax bracket their extra salary put them in meant it wasn't worth the extra hassle. B
This is an argument for a tax system with more gradual progression and fewer big jumps. Think of it as a nine speed cassette rather than a Sturmey Archer.

Sorry, am I allowed to reference cycling in This Place?
 

winjim

Welcome yourself into the new modern crisis
I think it best that the first thing you should do is to explain, under your duty of candour, that you are not fully concentrating on their care because you are on a cycling forum. Then review your trusts IT policy.

When you have done that, give us a quick run down on how your wealth tax may work for those who don't have much money, but have 'accidentally' found themselves wealthy by virtue of property prices, inheritances etc.
Your question has been addressed by me, and answered by me and by others, several times already on this thread including, tangentially, in the post you quoted.

Now, I really think you need to give me an answer about this high cholesterol. And also there's a pregnant woman complaining of itching. She's got raised ALP but normal ALT and low bile acids. What should I write on her report?
 

Craig the cyclist

Über Member
Your question has been addressed by me, and answered by me and by others, several times already on this thread including, tangentially, in the post you quoted.

Now, I really think you need to give me an answer about this high cholesterol. And also there's a pregnant woman complaining of itching. She's got raised ALP but normal ALT and low bile acids. What should I write on her report?
I have checked and can't find it, could you just quote the post where you state how much you need to be 'wealthy'?

Why are you asking random questions and not concentrating on the reports you are supposed to be writing? Are you trying to weirdly catch me out?
 

mudsticks

Squire
Sounds good at first, but gives the State complete power over the citizenry. Might be OK if the State is benign, but what if it isn't but gets taken over by control freaks with a social engineering agenda or either the right or the left?
I don't particularly see why it has to give State any more 'complete power' than it already has through the tax and social security systems.
.
We are talking about a no strings attached, not even means tested , equal portion being gifted, of those much higher fossil fuel taxes, giving it back equally to everyone.

Some will really need it, others not,
(some might not choose to take up their portion, or possibly pass it on to charity instead but that's a side issue)

But the idea is that it massively and quickly shifts revenue in the direction of the less well off, who tend to use less energy anyway.

And via that spending alternative energy usage, and 'consimption' is encouraged to be more sustainable, both in industry and the home

Like I say it's been costed by that den of Marxists the IMF and apparently the figures add up..

This is frequently trotted out under the guise of 'fair' taxation, but at some point, if you exclude the hyper rich, it no longer becomes worthwhile to take risks with running a business or to 'improve yourself' by getting better qualified if ever increasing amounts of your money are taken by the State.

Well some mug had to go and say this. 🍺 ^_^ It's not actually far from reality, in the company I work for I've known of people promoted to more senior management positions who have given up the promotion because the higher tax bracket their extra salary put them in meant it wasn't worth the extra hassle. Big increase in stress, generous increase in gross pay, petty increase in net pay. It's known as 'cold progression' here.

Conversely it can pay to reduce to a 4 day week as a 20% drop in gross pay entails only a 9% drop in net pay.
I understand that some folks don't want to take promotion and the higher status / responsibility with it, even if incentivised by money.

Maybe that's as it should be, if it doesn't suit them.

So then we can look at job sharing , shorter working weeks and spreading that load of greater responsibility between more people.


Rather than as if often the case now, having large numbers of people stressed by over work and too much responsibility, while others have all the stressors associated of being under employed.

I run two businesses which are both profitable.

I probably work quite hard by some peoples standards
But I don't overdo it.

I pay a reasonable chunk of tax each year, that's fine, I use and have used public services over the years, as have my kids, I will use them in the future, I should pay tax for these things while I'm able.

I wouldn't mind paying more for better services.

As it is 'our' gov is currently shamelessly spaffing, and stealing our tax money whilst trying to blame the poorest in society for the problems in society.

In collusion with the tabloid press they've got large cohorts believing that the already struggling are the ones to blame.

I have more than enough money to live on, am able to give some money to charity, and tithe some of my time to other socially useful work .

I wasn't put off starting my own businesses by the thought that if they were successful I'd have to pay more tax.

I don't think I'm really that unusual in any or all of the above

There is a certain culture of extreme selfishness lately promoted by certain political ideologies (Tories)

But in truth most people see the sense in paying a share towards the services from which we all ultimately benefit..
Even if not directly
 
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winjim

Welcome yourself into the new modern crisis
It's a bold approach, I'll give you that.
I have checked and can't find it, could you just quote the post where you state how much you need to be 'wealthy'?

Why are you asking random questions and not concentrating on the reports you are supposed to be writing? Are you trying to weirdly catch me out?
It's rhetoric. They're not real patients. Obviously.
 

BoldonLad

Old man on a bike. Not a member of a clique.
Location
South Tyneside
Interestingly, and to forestall one possible objection, the Finnish trial of this showed that the unemployed on a 'universal' income were more likely to find paid employment than those on traditional benefits.

Yes, I have always thought that it seemed like a good idea (no scientific reason, proof or sources, just a gut feeling). I do have reservations about the level at which the Universal Income would be set, have a feeling there may be much wrangling about what defines a "poverty level" and what is an acceptable level, a bit like the wrangling about Minimum Wage/Living Wage etc. Plus, would we need to have London weighting for Universal Credit. But, in principle, it has always struck me as a "good idea".
 
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