Starmer's vision quest

[midlandsgrimpeur]

Looks like Burnham has done his first U-turn and he's not even an MP yet, let alone running the country 🙂
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2026/05/17/andy-burnham-in-retreat-over-brexit-betrayal/

Maybe Lord Glasman has a point (quote from the article):

Burnham ‘will lose’ unless he embraces Brexit​

Lord Glasman, founder of the influential Blue Labour movement, said on Sunday that Mr Burnham would lose the Makerfield by-election unless he showed voters that he “grasps the positive benefits of Brexit”.

“He’s got to come out and say the future of our country is as a sovereign nation state, that we will renew our defence and our industry,” he said.

“If Andy Burnham doesn’t grasp the positive benefits of Brexit, he will lose. This isn’t Manchester he’s standing in: it’s Wigan. It is a 65 per cent Brexit seat.

“He has the future of the Labour Party in the palm of his hand. Labour has got to be a patriotic, sovereigntist party if it is to reconnect with working-class voters.”

Glasman is basically a hard right brexiteer (hard right, not far right!) that has infiltrated Labour to promote right wing policymaking. Anything he says, with regards to actual left wing politics is meaningless.

 

[bobzmyunkle]

Bobz, stop trying to deflect. I asked you to justify why in your view nationalisation is a good idea and youve ducked it twice now. Big fat leftie fail, but then again, I didn't expect anything else.

Troll. Once again you've refused to provide any backing for your increasingly stupid claims.

If you aren't going to answer my questions regarding Thames Water, perhaps you can justify this imbecilic statement.

I see a future Labour making me and the country considerably worse off. More so than Reform.

 

[secretsqirrel]

Glasman is basically a hard right brexiteer (hard right, not far right!) that has infiltrated Labour to promote right wing policymaking. Anything he says, with regards to actual left wing politics is meaningless.

“Glasman. You know sod all about politics, economic policy, Labour or solidarity. Bugger off and go ‘organise’ some communities."

John Prescott 2012

 

[briantrumpet]

Glasman is basically a hard right brexiteer (hard right, not far right!) that has infiltrated Labour to promote right wing policymaking. Anything he says, with regards to actual left wing politics is meaningless.

He's nuts, cosplaying some sort of intellectual. Reminds me a bit of Piers Corbyn. He'd be right at home in Reform.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piers_Corbyn

 

[midlandsgrimpeur]

He's nuts, cosplaying some sort of intellectual. Reminds me a bit of Piers Corbyn. He'd be right at home in Reform.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piers_Corbyn

Hopefully the next PM will tell him his input is no longer required (in slightly more forceful terms though!).

 

[C R]

Hopefully the next PM will tell him his input is no longer required (in slightly more forceful terms though!).

And he'll go crying about anti semitism to the usual suspects.

 

[briantrumpet]

Troll. Once again you've refused to provide any backing for your increasingly stupid claims.

If you aren't going to answer my questions regarding Thames Water, perhaps you can justify this imbecilic statement.

The clever bit about Reform is getting poor people thinking that Reform is batting for them, whereas in fact it's only going to benefit the already very well-off who alreadt have private healthcare etc. It's just the same with Trumpism: the rich people need the votes of poor people, exactly the people who are going to get hit hardest.

 

[First Aspect]

The clever bit about Reform is getting poor people thinking that Reform is batting for them, whereas in fact it's only going to benefit the already very well-off who alreadt have private healthcare etc. It's just the same with Trumpism: the rich people need the votes of poor people, exactly the people who are going to get hit hardest.

Correct. And in the UK and US alike being told this by already rich people who pretend to identify with the less well off masquerades as an opportunity to be more like them. A posh accent helps as well.

 

[icowden]

Bobz, stop trying to deflect. I asked you to justify why in your view nationalisation is a good idea and youve ducked it twice now. Big fat leftie fail, but then again, I didn't expect anything else.

@bobzmyunkle didn't deflect. He asked you a clear and specific question which provides the answer to your question.

Tell me the amount of debt Thames Water had at privatisation. Tell me how much debt they have now. Then explain why privatisation has been so successful for customers of Thames Water

You are the one deflecting by refusing to acknowledge or counter the argument. Presumably because there is no real justification for allowing foreign companies to extract all the value in our water utilities leaving only debt for the Government.

So stop ducking the question. Why do you think they should stay private and why do you think you, and the country, would be better off with a Reform government led by a shyster willing to take vast sums of money to lobby for the cause of the super rich?

 

[Pblakeney]

@bobzmyunkle didn't deflect. He asked you a clear and specific question which provides the answer to your question.



You are the one deflecting by refusing to acknowledge or counter the argument. Presumably because there is no real justification for allowing foreign companies to extract all the value in our water utilities leaving only debt for the Government.

So stop ducking the question. Why do you think they should stay private and why do you think you, and the country, would be better off with a Reform government led by a shyster willing to take vast sums of money to lobby for the cause of the super rich?

Stevo will vote for whoever promises the largest tax cuts.
No need to think past that.

 

[Rusty Nails]

Yes, I would agree. So, would that suggest being a Football manager is better career choice than being a Party Leader? 😂

At top levels, yes financially, but both are bad for your mental health.

 

[tarric]

Stevo will vote for whoever promises the largest tax cuts.
No need to think past that.

And the problem with that is that it doesn't matter which colour ribbon they pin on on election day, they will always make sure their backers are taken care of. Which means the person in the middle will always be left holding the tax bill. The poor can't pay and the rich won't.

 

[TailWindHome]

I see a future Labour making me and the country considerably worse off. More so than Reform.

I'm content with you being worse off
We'll see how it goes for the country

I'd gently point out how happy you were with the Truss budget, so your judgement may be off.

 

[briantrumpet]

I'd gently point out how happy you were with the Truss budget, so your judgement may be off.

Maybe, like Brexit, Trussism wasn't done properly.

 

[midlandsgrimpeur]

The clever bit about Reform is getting poor people thinking that Reform is batting for them, whereas in fact it's only going to benefit the already very well-off who alreadt have private healthcare etc. It's just the same with Trumpism: the rich people need the votes of poor people, exactly the people who are going to get hit hardest.

True and the same has always been a core component of populism. My question is, how and why people always fall for it? History shows that marginalised groups always tend to stay marginalised. Populism takes root when people grow desperate and angry with the status quo, and look elsewhere. It always ends in the same disappointment/disaster though. I never really understand why a person who thinks that every political party has failed then believes that a different one will succeed?