Starmer's vision quest

[Psamathe]

Easy to say things are inefficient and easy to say "we need change". But what so many in politics don't appreciate is that it's more nuanced than that and what we actually need is "Change for the better". Politicians seem stuck on "Something needs to be done; this is something so let's do it".

 

[Shortfall]

Having listened to the podcast, he's really angry that the Army may face prosecution for murders they committed in NI

I'm going to suggest it's a good thing that there's an external recourse (ECHR) if state forces murder their own citizens.

Sorry if this held Cummings back from moving fast and breaking things.

I think the point he makes is that they were sent by their government to do exactly that, and in some cases awarded medals for it, and then told by a subsequent government to lawyer up because they were getting dragged through the courts. All this at the same time as terrorists were being released under the Good Friday Agreement

 

[TailWindHome]

I think the point he makes is that they were sent by their government to do exactly that, and in some cases awarded medals for it, and then told by a subsequent government to lawyer up because they were getting dragged through the courts. All this at the same time as terrorists were being released under the Good Friday Agreement

Quite an admission he makes, isn't it?

 

[Shortfall]

Other than the EHCR all of the mechanisms mentioned are chosen by the government to assist in the process of government decision making and, if they are 'bogging' the government down, it is a fault of that government (whether Tory or Labour) rather than the mechanisms. IMO this is preferable to the sort of situation that we had when Thatcher was in charge and she ignored cabinet responsibility or decision-making (a bit like Blair and his 'sofa government) or the sort of situation that the US currently has where Trump rides roughshod over the mechanisms within the constitution, or even the issue that may arise if Farage ever got into power with the ragtag bunch of chancers in Reform. I can see why Cummings, from his experience as power behind the throne, dislikes the idea of someone diluting his influence.

The EHCR is a separate issue as it is an external influence that UK governments have historically signed up to, and I fully understand why the arch Brexiteer dislikes it.

And yet here we are 2 trillion (+) in debt, nothing works, taxes at historic high levels, unemployment rising, 9.1 economically inactive people and a porous border. If this is evidence that our government and institutions are effective then God help us.

 

[TailWindHome]

We should bring in big brains like Elon

 

[Rusty Nails]

I think the point he makes is that they were sent by their government to do exactly that, and in some cases awarded medals for it, and then told by a subsequent government to lawyer up because they were getting dragged through the courts. All this at the same time as terrorists were being released under the Good Friday Agreement

We're they (either the soldiers or their senior officers) actually told to kill (murder) people outside the recognised norms of military regulations or rules of engagement?

The fact that Cummings says they were told by government they should do so is his interpretation and not necessarily a fact, a bit like his reasons for his trip to Barnard Castle.

 

[Rusty Nails]

And yet here we are 2 trillion in debt, nothing works, taxes at historic high levels, unemployment rising, 9.1 economically inactive people and a porous border. If this is evidence that our government and institutions are effective then God help us.

I never said that.

It may be as simple as the quality of our politicians is and has been crap for many years and they haven't been using those institutions as effectively as they should.

 

[Shortfall]

I never said that.

It may be as simple as the quality of our politicians is and has been crap for many years and they haven't been using those institutions as effectively as they should.

Cummins says it's both. I tend to agree with him

 

[First Aspect]

Cummins points to various mechanisms/institutions that bog the government down and prevent them from carrying out their program. He cites the Cabinet Office that effectively assumes the powers that ministers once had, the ECHR, and the fact that so much of policy is now ceded to QUANGOs and set in law rather than elected ministers who are accountable to parliament and the public. You are free to disagree with his analysis but I don't think anyone can argue that the government and our institutions are effective in delivering services and performing their functions. The evidence is all around us. So rather than people telling me what a cünt Cummins is or asking am I some kind of a comedian for agreeing with a lot of what he says, I am asking them to tell me where he's wrong and what would they do instead?

Am I alone in being grateful that the bureaucracy got in the way of Dominic Cummings running the country?

 

[Shortfall]

Am I alone in being grateful that the bureaucracy got in the way of Dominic Cummings running the country?

No you're not. We have plenty of people who think we need more bureaucracy, more government and more taxes. We will likely get that when Labour lurches further to the left when they oust Starmer. I think many of those people will live to regret that and find out the hard way. I know this is a minority view here and I'm unlikely to win any hearts and minds which is why I'm going to retire to another whisky and say goodnight.

 

[briantrumpet]

Am I alone in being grateful that the bureaucracy got in the way of Dominic Cummings running the country?

It's just Yes Minister updated, but with politicians who think that posts on X are a substitute for actually governing. Tories and Labour both guilty.

 

[Rusty Nails]

Cummins says it's both. I tend to agree with him

If the institutions are crap that's possibly the fault of the politicians and the way they use them. I only agreee that Cummings saw the institutions as ineffective because they got in the way of him and unelected people like him running things they way they wanted.

SPADs often have delusions of grandeur, as I know from a friend of mine who was a senior SPAD before retirement and had a very low opinion of the abilities of many those he advised.

 

[Psamathe]

It may be as simple as the quality of our politicians is and has been crap for many years and they haven't been using those institutions as effectively as they should.

including their advisors (eg Cummings).

In part 'cos politicians mostly have no experience in business and think that listening to a few business people who funded their campaigns and who thus get access to lobby for their self-interests makes up for the "knowledge" they lack when making policy.

 

[Pblakeney]

Yeah we can do that. Or we can look at what we have here and why it isn't working. As a fellow Eeyore I know you agree that we're fücked so if you don't agree with Cummins theory that we have an ineffective civil service, sub standard ministers (because anyone with a brain doesn't want to work in Government) and a system of government that is hide bound by the ECHR , then what is your analysis? How do we break.out of the malaise? How do we avoid (mis) managed decline?

Well, we can witness the shitshow across the pond and decide not to do that. Put Farage in his box and that in itself would be a step forward.
I can see that the ECHR will be the next bogeyman after people in boats. It is not even a marginal cause for this county's malaise.
Maybe getting rid of unelected advisors who think they are in charge would be a start. Listening to advice is good, doing as told is wrong.