Universal credit: Should the temporary increase be kept for longer?

[Bromptonaut]

It bloody is.

"This increase has now been cut."

The whole system is a nightmare. A friend of mine's girlfriend was diagnosed with cancer shortly before Covid hit. The process she had to go through to claim UC was ridiculous.

The so called Work Capability Assessment is an inhuman nightmare. I've had a client with a Heart Lung transplant who could barely walk across the Atrium at the Council Office found fit for work.

The basic process from application to payment seems, for ordinary people who match the template, straightforward. Chuck a curve ball in there though like Right to Reside or an informal tenancy and it goes to pot

 

[AndyRM]

The so called Work Capability Assessment is an inhuman nightmare. I've had a client with a Heart Lung transplant who could barely walk across the Atrium at the Council Office found fit for work.

The basic process from application to payment seems, for ordinary people who match the template, straightforward. Chuck a curve ball in there though like Right to Reside or an informal tenancy and it goes to pot

Ah, yes, that's the name. I've seen the form, it's absolutely outrageous.

 

[Craig the cyclist]

The so called Work Capability Assessment is an inhuman nightmare. I've had a client with a Heart Lung transplant who could barely walk across the Atrium at the Council Office found fit for work.

This bit is very tricky. I know an assessor very well, she went to a claimant who said he could only walk about 15m, during the assessment it became clearly that would only be with a following wind and all moons aligned, she asked why he said he could do that and he said that he could do it given time (about a day and half was her comment).

She also went to a claimant who said similar, after the meeting she was making some calls and he cycled out of his path, one handed talking on his mobile, until he rode into a car while looking straight at her with a horrified look on his face.

Sadly the claimants like the second have worn down a lot of assessors and they have become hardbitten and suspicious. Put it on the list of things that need to be changed, but in a controlled and sensible way!

 

[Deleted member 49]

This bit is very tricky. I know an assessor very well, she went to a claimant who said he could only walk about 15m, during the assessment it became clearly that would only be with a following wind and all moons aligned, she asked why he said he could do that and he said that he could do it given time (about a day and half was her comment).

She also went to a claimant who said similar, after the meeting she was making some calls and he cycled out of his path, one handed talking on his mobile, until he rode into a car while looking straight at her with a horrified look on his face.

Sadly the claimants like the second have worn down a lot of assessors and they have become hardbitten and suspicious. Put it on the list of things that need to be changed, but in a controlled and sensible way!

Yea I knew someone on UC who had a iPhone....and he used to socialize in the pub !
Beggers belief.

 

[deptfordmarmoset]

This bit is very tricky. I know an assessor very well, she went to a claimant who said he could only walk about 15m, during the assessment it became clearly that would only be with a following wind and all moons aligned, she asked why he said he could do that and he said that he could do it given time (about a day and half was her comment).

She also went to a claimant who said similar, after the meeting she was making some calls and he cycled out of his path, one handed talking on his mobile, until he rode into a car while looking straight at her with a horrified look on his face.

Sadly the claimants like the second have worn down a lot of assessors and they have become hardbitten and suspicious. Put it on the list of things that need to be changed, but in a controlled and sensible way!

Oh, the poor traumatised assessors!

 

[Rusty Nails]

Everybody has stories.

My next door neighbour, a former senior nurse, got a job as an assessor. He gave it up after three months because of the pressure to turn people down that he thought/knew were genuine. He knew of others in the same situation as him.

He was no bleeding heart and has strong views on people he thinks are conning the system, but even he had enough of it.

 

[Craig the cyclist]

Oh, the poor traumatised assessors!

Oh, as ever, a bit of sarcasm goes down well with the audience eh? However, the assessors I know try and do a good and fair job.

As ever, and for god knows how many times now, the system needs reform, but I will say that I have been involved with people claiming benefits for at least the last 30 years, and I haven't seen a perfect system yet, have you? Which one would you go back to? Or as ever, you all take the easy route of saying 'the system is wrong' while studiously avoiding making any recommendations or suggestions as to how you would run the system, because you all know that actually there is no perfect system and anything you say would be easily pulled apart and you made to look a twat within minutes.

 

[AndyRM]

Oh, as ever, a bit of sarcasm goes down well with the audience eh? However, the assessors I know try and do a good and fair job.

As ever, and for god knows how many times now, the system needs reform, but I will say that I have been involved with people claiming benefits for at least the last 30 years, and I haven't seen a perfect system yet, have you? Which one would you go back to? Or as ever, you all take the easy route of saying 'the system is wrong' while studiously avoiding making any recommendations or suggestions as to how you would run the system, because you all know that actually there is no perfect system and anything you say would be easily pulled apart and you made to look a twat within minutes.

Errrrr, you're also saying the system is wrong, so...

I don't doubt that you and those you know are doing your best. But the fact of the matter is that it's a weird game which is designed to get those of us who are on UC, off it.

Equally, I don't know what the answer is for making things easier all round.

On a personal level, it would be nice if I could go to the Job Centre that's a 2 minute walk from me, rather than the one that's about 20. Or if my work coach could actually send me any jobs to apply for.

I appreciate that it may be different wherever it is you are, but in my neck of the woods it feels very much like the hoops needed to jump through are very much held by the Job Centre and there is very little flexibility.

 

[deptfordmarmoset]

Oh, as ever, a bit of sarcasm goes down well with the audience eh? However, the assessors I know try and do a good and fair job.

Sarcasm was my response to you focusing on the agents of a brutalising system rather than the brutalised.

 

[Craig the cyclist]

Sarcasm was my response to you focusing on the agents of a brutalising system rather than the brutalised.

Yep, as ever, focus on the player and not the ball.

Come on, which system would you use for assessing benefits, the rates of those benefits and who should get them?

I have said over and over, the system has problems, it needs review, but whatever is put in place will be met by people like you saying 'It's too confusing/ it isn't fair/ it's the rich keeping the poor down/ it's Tory heartlessness' all while having not the slightest clue about what to put in its place, and certainly not the balls to suggest any changes on a forum where you know full well it will be pulled to bits in a heartbeat.

Errrrr, you're also saying the system is wrong, so...

.....it needs changing, I don't know how many times I have said that. I assume though, that you believe all will be well with the UC system by just adding £20 a week to it? Or should the whole thing be reviewed and done in a proper way?

 

[Deleted member 49]

Yep, as ever, focus on the player and not the ball.

Come on, which system would you use for assessing benefits, the rates of those benefits and who should get them?

I have said over and over, the system has problems, it needs review, but whatever is put in place will be met by people like you saying 'It's too confusing/ it isn't fair/ it's the rich keeping the poor down/ it's Tory heartlessness' all while having not the slightest clue about what to put in its place, and certainly not the balls to suggest any changes on a forum where you know full well it will be pulled to bits in a heartbeat.


.....it needs changing, I don't know how many times I have said that. I assume though, that you believe all will be well with the UC system by just adding £20 a week to it? Or should the whole thing be reviewed and done in a proper way?

Universal basic Income....but closing the gap between the rich and the poor is never going to be a vote winner for the Tories.

 

[mudsticks]

Yep, as ever, focus on the player and not the ball.

Come on, which system would you use for assessing benefits, the rates of those benefits and who should get them?

I have said over and over, the system has problems, it needs review, but whatever is put in place will be met by people like you saying 'It's too confusing/ it isn't fair/ it's the rich keeping the poor down/ it's Tory heartlessness' all while having not the slightest clue about what to put in its place, and certainly not the balls to suggest any changes on a forum where you know full well it will be pulled to bits in a heartbeat.


.....it needs changing, I don't know how many times I have said that. I assume though, that you believe all will be well with the UC system by just adding £20 a week to it? Or should the whole thing be reviewed and done in a proper way?

Retain the present uplift.

Whilst reviewing and reforming the current system.

What's so complicated about doing that ?

 

[mudsticks]

Universal basic Income....but closing the gap between the rich and the poor is never going to be a vote winner for the Tories.

Having a cohort of slightly, or even very desperate people , is useful if you want to do all kinds of things.

Populism thrives on strife, unhappiness, and want.

 

[deptfordmarmoset]

Yep, as ever, focus on the player and not the ball.

No, I'm focused on those who are being played.

As to the question about the benefits system, the universal wage/basic income is well worth exploring, as @Adam4868 suggests, and maintaining the £20 per week will help - as a stopgap - in the face of inflation and soaring heating costs as winter approaches, like @mudsticks suggests.

 

[Archie_tect]

Craig,
Genuine question - no political side or angle or sarcasm intended.

If you, someone who knows the present system with 30 years experience, can't fathom how to improve and, just as importantly, cost the benefits system for the benefit of the vulnerable and the people who need it, for whatever their circumstances, how can 'people like us' actually help to lobby Government in a positive way?