Worse than Murder?

[spen666]

One of the very few offences that carry a manadatory life sentence is murder.

Now without trying to minimise the crime, a murder could be quick and relatively instant - eg a shooting etc. Despite this you get a life sentence ( and rightly so)
Then we have an offence like this one https://tinyurl.com/2f7lm34q (apologies for the source if that upsets you) where a victim is horiffically tortured for 6 hours. and yet none of the perpetrators gets a life sentence

It may just be me, but the offences in this case are perhaps more horrific than a murder that is done instantly. People like these perpetrators, causing horrific suffering for hours , in my view probably should also be facing life sentences.

any thoughts?

 

[AuroraSaab]

I would guess that their ages (23, 20, 20) and guilty pleas were taken into account and lowered the sentences a bit. I'm not sure a life sentence would be appropriate but 6 years (minimum they will serve) will probably feel like an insult to the victim for what was a prolonged attack that could easily have resulted in their murder. I would imagine you never get over an assault like that.

 

[Beebo]

A drug dealer on drug dealer attack is never going to elicit much sympathy from the public.

 

[Deleted member 28]

Surely these fellow humans can't be held wholly responsible for their actions, government cutbacks, poor parenting due to something the Tories have no doubt done and just a 'poor start in life'.

Heaven forbid someone mentions capital punishment!

 

[matticus]

A drug dealer on drug dealer attack is never going to elicit much sympathy from the public.

Fortunately sentencing is not yet left to the public! But I know what you mean ...

As to Spen's initial point, I'd say they're totally different situations, apples-n-pears - too hard to compare.

It's a hell of a thing, killing a man. Take away all he's got and all he's ever gonna have.

 

[Electric_Andy]

Surely these fellow humans can't be held wholly responsible for their actions, government cutbacks, poor parenting due to something the Tories have no doubt done and just a 'poor start in life'.

Heaven forbid someone mentions capital punishment!

The other thread was about preventing "poor starts in life", not about being lenient towards sadistic maniacs

 

[theclaud]

apologies for the source if that upsets you

Just paste the link so where we can see where it goes, Spen, rather than concealing it, then we can decide whether to visit or to look for the same news elsewhere.

 

[icowden]

It may just be me, but the offences in this case are perhaps more horrific than a murder that is done instantly. People like these perpetrators, causing horrific suffering for hours , in my view probably should also be facing life sentences.

They were charged with grievous bodily harm with intent which carries a maximum sentence of 16 years. That is the Judge's limitation. Two of them pled guilty from the off, so their maximum is 11 years. As usual the Daily Mail has sensationalised it.

One could be out in about 9 years, one in about 7 years and one in about 5 years but will have an extended license period of 4 years.

Should it be higher? Good question. What would be the benefit of keeping them in prison for longer? Are they a danger to other people - possibly but this was a dealer on dealer assault, so probably not particularly. Are they nice people - clearly not. Is there a chance to rehabilitate them within the span of their sentences, possibly.

I don't agree with the Conservative mantra of constantly calling for tougher sentences. To be it seems about right. Given that we haven't got the Judgement to read, we can't fully understand how the Judge arrived at the sentences. Tougher sentences were available, so we must therefore be missing information that tells us why they were not tougher.

 

[Deleted member 28]

The other thread was about preventing "poor starts in life", not about being lenient towards sadistic maniacs

I was pulled up over calling someone a scumbag irrespective of how they became one, I was then informed that they're all 'fellow humans' so from that I take it you lefty lot see all criminals in this light so I'll just continue to refer to them as I see fit and so can you.

 

[Hitchington]

Shep posting his usual drivel is 'worse than murder.'

 

[Deleted member 28]

Shep posting his usual drivel is 'worse than murder.'

What?

 

[Deleted member 121]

I still can't get my head around the question of "Worse than Murder?"

Does that insinuate some sort of mercy that should be rewarded?

I'm afraid i cannot continue this discussion beyond that point, my last few neurons have definitely blew... I lost too many when trying to understand the Peter Gabriel era Genesis Lyrics...

 

[icowden]

I was pulled up over calling someone a scumbag irrespective of how they became one,

No you weren't. You were pulled up for effectively calling everyone on council estates scumbags. Your memory is very selective.

 

[spen666]

Just paste the link so where we can see where it goes, Spen, rather than concealing it, then we can decide whether to visit or to look for the same news elsewhere.

Erm,

I did post the link

 

[spen666]

They were charged with grievous bodily harm with intent which carries a maximum sentence of 16 years. That is the Judge's limitation.

GBH with intent, carries a maximum sentence of life imprisonment not 16 years.

s18 Offences Against the Person's Act 1868

Two of them pled guilty from the off, so their maximum is 11 years. As usual the Daily Mail has sensationalised it.

One could be out in about 9 years, one in about 7 years and one in about 5 years but will have an extended license period of 4 years.

Should it be higher? Good question. What would be the benefit of keeping them in prison for longer? Are they a danger to other people - possibly but this was a dealer on dealer assault, so probably not particularly. Are they nice people - clearly not. Is there a chance to rehabilitate them within the span of their sentences, possibly.

I don't agree with the Conservative mantra of constantly calling for tougher sentences. To be it seems about right. Given that we haven't got the Judgement to read, we can't fully understand how the Judge arrived at the sentences.

The Judge sentences according to the Sentencing Guide, which is detailed and available online to anyone to read here

https://www.sentencingcouncil.org.uk/crown-court/

Tougher sentences were available, so we must therefore be missing information that tells us why they were not tougher.