Israel / Palestine

[qigong chimp]

If it would help move things along I might be prepared to say Hamas are great, especially their humanitarian work.

 

[cookiemonster]

see above

Where?

 

[Ian H]

By the way, just for balance, here's a Dutch friend of mine -

View: https://www.instagram.com/p/CzR_4EVtVlf/?img_index=1

 

[albion]

https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...ived-threats-after-israeli-sports-ban-retweet

'Of criticism of his stance on the war, Lineker said: “But I don’t see it as a Jewish thing. I see it as the Israeli government. Obviously, they’re responding to 7 October, but crikey, one atrocity does not deserve 80 atrocities. Or more.” '

That crazy redefining of antisemitism was also an Israeli government thing.

 

[dutchguylivingintheuk]

A friend with contacts in the West Bank reports increased trouble & harassment there. His comment: As well as Gaza, contacts on the west bank report that it is worse there than before.
Some people speculate that the Israeli government are trying to provoke another intifada.

And other speculate it's all the Palestians their fault, that the whole reason why the conflict still happens, tow parties blame each other for everything and there is no third party to preserve justice or balance but more then enough parties to do well with stirring up tensions. for example Iranian proxies, Hamas, and similar terror organisation and from the isreali side you have those setlers that want to steal land, and numerous other fraction that don't really want peace, including Natahnyahu's party.

That crazy redefining of antisemitism was also an Israeli government thing.

Both do that, Hamas pro palestina is just as much in an information war trying to re-define terms, wheter it is genocide, terrorist as ''freedom fighters'' etc.

 

[All uphill]

and there is no third party to preserve justice or balance

Maybe you could set a good example of balance?

Perhaps on the lines of

"The Israeli government is appalling and Hamas is appalling".

"People in Gaza and Israel do not deserve to suffer"

"Western governments should work towards a ceasefire and two state solution"

 

[Ian H]

Well done Exeter.

 

[AndyRM]

I suppose this isn't exactly new for Netanyahu, but I don't see how it's a good thing that he seems incapable of budging in any way.

Not that Hamas are either, but there's got to be compromise from both sides if any kind of resolution can be worked out.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-68045247

 

[dutchguylivingintheuk]

I suppose this isn't exactly new for Netanyahu, but I don't see how it's a good thing that he seems incapable of budging in any way.

Not that Hamas are either, but there's got to be compromise from both sides if any kind of resolution can be worked out.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-68045247

Earlier rumors about a peace deal brokered by Egypt, Saudi and Jordan are then either not true or he knowns who he is bargaining with. That deal would see Hamas all leaving gaza and control to be handeld to a coalition of Egypt Saudi and Jordan. Reportely Hamas, alltough it included an get out of jail free card for them. seems more likely Isreal/netahnyaho wasn't keen either.

 

[BoldonLad]

I suppose this isn't exactly new for Netanyahu, but I don't see how it's a good thing that he seems incapable of budging in any way.

Not that Hamas are either, but there's got to be compromise from both sides if any kind of resolution can be worked out.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-68045247

Very true, but, at present, it looks like a case of 'who blinks first". Very sad for the civilians on both sides caught up in this mess, and, if/when it escalates, perhaps, very sad for all of us.

 

[Ian H]

All Netanyahu is worried about is staying out of jail. He doesn't care how many people die because of that.

 

[AndyRM]

Earlier rumors about a peace deal brokered by Egypt, Saudi and Jordan are then either not true or he knowns who he is bargaining with. That deal would see Hamas all leaving gaza and control to be handeld to a coalition of Egypt Saudi and Jordan. Reportely Hamas, alltough it included an get out of jail free card for them. seems more likely Isreal/netahnyaho wasn't keen either.

From what I understand, the Egyptian idea was legit and actually made some sense, but was rejected by both sides.

 

[AuroraSaab]

Some ideas about what a post-Hamas Gaza might look like here:

https://www.washingtoninstitute.org...and-principles-post-hamas-administration-gaza

Increasingly difficult to imagine neighbours like Jordan or Saudi wanting to play a large role though and it would be hard to implement a new Palestinian Authority that was totally free from Hamas influence. Non starter at the moment anyway as neither the Israeli government nor Hamas are publicly showing any interest in a 2 state solution, though that may change.

 

[albion]

From what I understand, the Egyptian idea was legit and actually made some sense, but was rejected by both sides.

It was a very workable idea, those countries well tied to the west.
Where would Hamas go though? Whilst they garner support, I have doubts anyone would actually want them.

 

[dutchguylivingintheuk]

Some ideas about what a post-Hamas Gaza might look like here:

https://www.washingtoninstitute.org...and-principles-post-hamas-administration-gaza

Increasingly difficult to imagine neighbours like Jordan or Saudi wanting to play a large role though and it would be hard to implement a new Palestinian Authority that was totally free from Hamas influence. Non starter at the moment anyway as neither the Israeli government nor Hamas are publicly showing any interest in a 2 state solution, though that may change.

Well i think they prefer that above the alternative of Iran trained and supplied satelitte state.(what Gaza currently partly is.)

It was a very workable idea, those countries well tied to the west.
Where would Hamas go though? Whilst they garner support, I have doubts anyone would actually want them.

Hell and or just where isisis now.