Israel / Palestine

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Psamathe

Well-Known Member
It is very grim indeed.

There could be a multitude of variables and i suspect any reality to any claim would largely be hidden forever. That's the sick thing about any war regardless of blame.
Made worse when it's used to flame outrage for personal political interests & agenda.

A true leader would have announced the findings and stated that inquiries are ongoing to investigate and resolve along with sympathy for the families impacted not to attempt to drive hatred.

Ian
 

glasgowcyclist

Über Member
It appears the correct body has now been returned to the family.

From the BBC:
“Hamas spokesman Ismail al-Thawabta said in a post on X on Friday that Shiri's remains seemed to have been mixed up with other bodies under rubble after the air strike.”


Seems perfectly plausible to me.
 
Rape though? It's not like it's an inevitable part and parcel of armed conflict. Rape isn't an instrument, the use of which frees you from oppression.
It's part of spreading terror that why in decent armies, soldiers commiting rape will be procecuted. (and before all the ''but idf'' and the likes of uselesstool jump in, yes the idf has been accused of rape as an tatic of war before and the idf has fired and procecuted soldiers before. Having said that that does not mean i believe the idf is holy or any crime commited by their soldiers is actually procecuted)
Made worse when it's used to flame outrage for personal political interests & agenda.

A true leader would have announced the findings and stated that inquiries are ongoing to investigate and resolve along with sympathy for the families impacted not to attempt to drive hatred.

Ian
Bit rich to state that if Hamas has made a giant podium to display hostages and coffin's on.
It appears the correct body has now been returned to the family.

From the BBC:
“Hamas spokesman Ismail al-Thawabta said in a post on X on Friday that Shiri's remains seemed to have been mixed up with other bodies under rubble after the air strike.”


Seems perfectly plausible to me.
If it was coming from a reliable party yes, but Hamas lies so much you can't really say they reliable now are you? It's very convenient to blame an airstrike too.
 
It appears the correct body has now been returned to the family.

From the BBC:
“Hamas spokesman Ismail al-Thawabta said in a post on X on Friday that Shiri's remains seemed to have been mixed up with other bodies under rubble after the air strike.”


Seems perfectly plausible to me.

They found the correct body pretty quickly, considering they claimed she was killed in an air strike in November 2023. You have to wonder why they didn't get it right first time. Still, probably best to give those Hamas lads the benefit of the doubt.
 

HMS_Dave

Regular
They found the correct body pretty quickly, considering they claimed she was killed in an air strike in November 2023. You have to wonder why they didn't get it right first time. Still, probably best to give those Hamas lads the benefit of the doubt.

You have to be somewhat realistic in expectations. Ignoring the whole goodies and baddies for a moment, an area that has been largely and as far as i can tell, was probably totally without power since 2023, and largely rubble and ruin, im not sure what people are really expecting when the media refer to a "body being handed over" after such a long time... Specialist forensic equipment would be required which isn't always available to everybody.
 

AndyRM

Elder Goth
It's part of spreading terror that why in decent armies, soldiers commiting rape will be procecuted. (and before all the ''but idf'' and the likes of uselesstool jump in, yes the idf has been accused of rape as an tatic of war before and the idf has fired and procecuted soldiers before. Having said that that does not mean i believe the idf is holy or any crime commited by their soldiers is actually procecuted)

Bit rich to state that if Hamas has made a giant podium to display hostages and coffin's on.

If it was coming from a reliable party yes, but Hamas lies so much you can't really say they reliable now are you? It's very convenient to blame an airstrike too.

You lost me at "decent armies".

There's no such thing.
 

AndyRM

Elder Goth
Of course there are

Best looking
Best uniform
Best weapons
😁

I'm at a loss for the first one because that's subjective but fill your boots.

I'd go with:

The Third Reich and Russia in your other categories.
 

multitool

Guest
You have to be somewhat realistic in expectations. Ignoring the whole goodies and baddies for a moment, an area that has been largely and as far as i can tell, was probably totally without power since 2023, and largely rubble and ruin, im not sure what people are really expecting when the media refer to a "body being handed over" after such a long time... Specialist forensic equipment would be required which isn't always available to everybody.

It speaks to the overpowering effect of wall-to-wall propaganda, and the power of the Israeli lobby, that people are obsessing over one dead Israeli body and two dead Israeli children, whom they know by name, and ignoring the 18,000 dead Arab children, none of whom they can name, or the 30,000 adult dead Arab bodies, none of whom they can name, or the 20,000 other missing dead people, buried under the ruins of what is now 65% of Gaza.
 

Psamathe

Well-Known Member
Article "Israel indefinitely delays Palestinian prisoner release as hostages freed"

Daft but I suspect it might be a test. Israel unilaterally breaks the ceasefire agreement. However distasteful the way Hamas are releasing their hostages, as far as I can see it complies with the ceasefire agreement so Netanyahu decides to break it anyway. Won't inspire confidence in the negotiations for the next phase of the ceasefire.

But I wonder if it's Israel testing the US. Are the US going to go along and support Israel or are they going to tell Israel "adhere to the agreement, NOW!". Israel have left themselves a loophole so if the US tell them to comply behind the scenes Netanyahu can just announce they have received the reassurances and immediately comply. But if the US go along with Netanyahu then whatever Hamas agree to Netanyahu can stick with "Not adequate assurances".

Any assurances Netanyahu wants can be built into the next ceasefire agreement and don't need to be given now so no point in breaking the agreement at this point for the assurances - just include the requirements in the phase 2.

So my (without evidence) suspicion is it's testing the stance and resolve of the US.

Ian
 
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