multitool
Pharaoh
The whole point of those rules is that they are not flexible.
I've explained this ad nauseum.
Schooliform
- Thread starter icowden
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The whole point of those rules is that they are not flexible.
I've explained this ad nauseum.
Electric_Andy
Regular
I don't agree with those signs. Not all learning is done in a classroom, and it's not all academic. A big part of going to school is learning how to be an adult when the time comes, and learning about real life in general. I wouldn't want to teach my son or daughter to think they can bend/break the rules just becasue they don't like them. IMO that encourages them to get a job at McDonald's (for example) and then choose their own way of wearing the uniform, and promtply get the sack. I've been in a job before where office attire was dropped for Fridays (we could wear jeans if we wanted), one lad came in with ripped jeans that looked awful, and he was promptly sent home for the day without pay.
People who want to live like this can do as they please, but they can't complain when they're kicked out in favour of someone else who chooses to tow the company line. Raising a child to believe that they have all the say in the world and can pick and choose which rules to follow or break is just not realistic.
D
Deleted member 121
Guest
Ahh yes, School. Preparing children for a life of work. Anybody else put their hand up to go to the toilet still? Or in the case of my daughters school and I will name and shame. Hart School in Rugeley, who refused my daughters classmate a trip to the toilet and bleed over her chair which understandably left her distraught. Still trying to figure out which job that might be preparing her for. A sniper assassin perhaps?
Rules should always be challenged. If they are good rules, they'll stand the test of time. If they are shït, they'll disappear...
Rules should always be challenged. If they are good rules, they'll stand the test of time. If they are shït, they'll disappear...
AndyRM
Elder Goth
Fab Foodie
Legendary Member
That's administration of the rule, not the rule itself. The teacher was wrong.
There's a hand raising function on Teams, we raise our hands to be heard in an audience or at a meeting when we wish to speak. I don't see anything wrong with that....
D
Deleted member 121
Guest
Yes, but I'm assuming you don't raise your hand to go for a piss on teams? These are different things entirely and I understand why raising your hand for attention is a good idea...
Fab Foodie
Legendary Member
If you have to leave on Teams, people usually put a note in the Chat to inform/apologies/excuse themselves for a moment.
If in school you have to raise your hand it's for the teacher to enquire why and make a decision based on the answer. Again, it's not the rule, it's the execution and it sounds like the teacher royally fcukdup.
OP
OP
icowden
Squire
To be fair, that's an area in which guidance has been issued. I think most schools now permit children to go to the toilet if they need to - they will however take note of serial toilet attenders and get the schools' nominated pastoral care teacher to have a word about writing an email to the parents suggesting that a GP visit might be in order if pupil x needs to go to the loo that frequently.... etc
D
Deleted member 121
Guest
I'm a bit sceptical of that guidance but in any case, refusing access to toilets, especially children is an egregious form of abuse and a disgrace that it required the commissioning of guidance to recognise.
OP
OP
icowden
Squire
I think it's more a reflection of changing times and values. Children didn't have negotiating powers or "rights" when I was at school. You did what you were told or else. For many teachers, part of teaching was an the ability to strike terror into pupils. We all knew who the evil teachers were - and the pushovers.
multitool
Pharaoh
I can't imagine that youths (love that word) would ever abuse the right to go to the toilet to go to pre-arranged meetings with their friends to chat/vape/smoke weed/ sell drugs/buy drugs/ avoid lessons/ do some vandalism/ use social media to provoke fights.
I'm equally sure that schools are tightening up on toilet use out of sheer cruelty, and not at all after hours of thought, reasoning, debate, consultation at management level.
After all, as some of the most vociferous
Electric_Andy
Regular
No, and I don't have to learn times tables as an adult either, does that mean kids shouldn't have to learn tables in school? It's the general principle of rules that they need to learn; the specifics aren't always applied to adulthood once they leave school. My son's school have started banning bags and blazers from the toilets, and checking pockets before students use the loo. Because some kids were vaping in the toilets. I explained to my son that this also happens in the real world i.e. there are blanket bans that affect everyone just because a minority cannot behave. It's a fact of life, and the earlier they learn that life is not always fair, the better
Ian H
Legendary Member
There is a website & email group which exist to prove that point with regard to my old grammar school. Some of the members are considerably older than me.
multitool
Pharaoh
Considerably older than you would entail people who attended school in the 1940s.
An amusing, if irrelevant, adjunct to the discussion in hand.
multitool
Pharaoh
The irony is not lost on me that the most vociferous complainants on this thread are the very same people who would issue forth on the inequities of the private school system, with its ingrained privilege.
Whilst I would be with them on the broader sociological aspects of that argument, I do have relatives who were privately educated and the ones at the most prestigious schools had very long working days, and no pîssing about in the name of "testing boundaries as a part of growing up" was included in their day. As a consequence, nor were their lessons disrupted by others.
My nephews had to work extremely hard to pass the entrance exams for the City of London school. Whilst attendance at that school may confer unearned advantages upon them, that attendance was earned. One nephew is now mucking about in Spain teaching TEFL, under the pretence that he is going to be an actor, and the other one works slavishly hard as an undergraduate architect.
What was it, I wonder, that conferred upon him this work ethic, and just how much better could he have done in life had he been allowed to waste his and his teachers time in school arguing the toss over absolutely-fûcking-everything?
Whilst I would be with them on the broader sociological aspects of that argument, I do have relatives who were privately educated and the ones at the most prestigious schools had very long working days, and no pîssing about in the name of "testing boundaries as a part of growing up" was included in their day. As a consequence, nor were their lessons disrupted by others.
My nephews had to work extremely hard to pass the entrance exams for the City of London school. Whilst attendance at that school may confer unearned advantages upon them, that attendance was earned. One nephew is now mucking about in Spain teaching TEFL, under the pretence that he is going to be an actor, and the other one works slavishly hard as an undergraduate architect.
What was it, I wonder, that conferred upon him this work ethic, and just how much better could he have done in life had he been allowed to waste his and his teachers time in school arguing the toss over absolutely-fûcking-everything?
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